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Topic: Arduino Due Obsolete? (Read 16483 times) previous topic - next topic

alexis_labminds

According to Mouser, one of the Arduino distributors, the Arduino Due A000062 is obsolete, is this true? 
Also, looking through the Arduino store, it's not there either...

Link: http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Arduinoorg/A000062/?qs=D9UofrEmuWn3CLF7hFoZGA%3D%3D

Anyone have any official word one way or another?

HermannSW

#1
Apr 29, 2016, 04:40 pm Last Edit: May 04, 2016, 04:05 pm by HermannSW
Hi,

in Germany I can buy Arduino Due at many electronic shops (>50$).
I did buy all my Arduino Dues as China clones on aliexpress.com (12$).

Below I copied out the Arduinos with more than 16MHz, I cannot see why one would want something different than Due given the features. The killer argument for me is the 96KB and high clock rate (I have no 101 to compare Due with 101). The additional 101 features can be added to Due for few $s.

So I think Due is not obsolete.

Hermann,

From http://www.arduino.cc/en/Products/Compare:

Name
 Processor
 

          Operating/InputVoltage
          

          CPU Speed
          

          Analog In/Out
          

          Digital IO/PWM
          

          EEPROM [kB]
          

          SRAM [kB]
          

          Flash [kB]
          

          
USB
          

          
UART
          

            101
            

            Intel® Curie
            

             3.3 V/ 7-12V
            

            32MHz
            

            6/0
            

            14/4
            

            -
            

            24
            

            196
            

            Regular
            

            -
            

            Due
            

            ATSAM3X8E
            

            3.3 V / 7-12 V
            

            84 MHz
            

            12/2
            

            54/12
            

            -
            

            96
            

            512
            

            2 Micro
            

            4
            

            MKR1000
            

            SAMD21 Cortex-M0+
            

             3.3 V/ 5V
            

            48MHz
            

            7/1
            

            8/4
            

            -
            

            32
            

            256
            

            Micro
            

            1
            

            Zero
            

            ATSAMD21G18
            

            3.3 V / 7-12 V
            

            48 MHz
            

            6/1
            

            14/10
            

            -
            

            32
            

            256
            

            2 Micro
            

            2
            
-
ESP8266-12ETensilica Xtensa LX106
            3.3 V / microUSB
            

            80 MHz
            

            1/0
            

            16/?
            

            -
            

            96
            

            512
            

            1 Micro
            

            -
            


<EDIT>added ESP8266-12E row after it is part of evaluation below</EDIT>

AdderD

Kind of... They don't seem overly interested in making too many more Due boards. The problem with the Due is that nobody bought it. It's *MUCH* more powerful than the little garbage Arduinos that most people buy and really isn't more money. But, it was unpopular because of the large change in processor and drop to 3.3v. So, I guess they've prioritized on the things that people buy. That's understandable even if it sucks.

But, there is a cottage industry of other companies that make clones of the board. EVTV.me sells a Due clone with a USB-B plug, EEPROM, and CANbus built-in. It's more money but they still make them and the board is more capable. If you don't need EEPROM or CAN then find a Chinese knock off. However, I've also been informed that Atmel is scheduling an end of life for the SAM3X processor on the Due. This probably won't fully happen for another couple of years but the writing is on the wall.

Personally I'm really liking the Cortex M7 processors from Atmel. The processor is leaps and bounds better than the M3 on the Due. Faster, more capable, more space, etc. I'd love to see a Due like board but with an M7. In fact, I very well might do just that.

c128scpu

I just received two of them today. I got them through Digikey. So for me at least they are not.

Okio

There's always the Teensy 3.2 with the M4 core, with I believe selectable CPU speed of 72 or 96mhz: https://www.sparkfun.com/products/13736

Palliser

Here a comment from Massimo Banzi at Arduino.cc (LLC) developers' discussion page:



https://groups.google.com/a/arduino.cc/forum/m/#!topic/developers/HEKecd0qhS4

MorganS

To me the real problem is the Due has lots of attractive features but many of them are disabled by the board. You can't use the real-time clock properly, the DAC would be 100 times more useful with a 0-5V amplifier, the ethernet pins are inaccessible, I2C has silly pullups (but only on one).

Some different design choices might have pushed the Due in a different direction. The Teensy is much more useful for a bigger range of things, although it's hampered by its desire to be small, so some useful pins are more difficult to access. It also has better library support for USB type things which the Due would also be good at.

I can't see the Due going away. It may not be stocked at Mouser next year but I'm sure you will be able to buy new ones at reasonable prices 10 years from now.
"The problem is in the code you didn't post."

HermannSW

#7
May 03, 2016, 07:58 pm Last Edit: May 04, 2016, 12:06 am by HermannSW
As I said above there is no reason for me not to choose a Due.

In this thread I did compare pure integer compute power of the Due with that of a modern PC Intel processor:
http://forum.arduino.cc/index.php?topic=391511.0


Due was factor 92(83) slower, but I was surprised that it was only a factor 92(83) [depending on compiler setting -Os, optimize for size, the default in Arduino IDE, or -O3, optimize for speed].

It would be interesting to just get the runtime reported for the other three (>16MHz) Arduinos in above table, the 101, MKR1000 and Zero.

If you do have access to one of those three Arduinos, could you please flash the sketch from the the thread mentioned and report the reported runtime here?

The Due number is:  548us (-Os)  494us (-O3)

Hermann.

sensorsiot

I did some test with the different Arduinos (incl. MKR1000 and Due) and also the ESP8266 and the Maple (STM32). It is not your benchmark, but could give you some ideas.

https://youtu.be/dE6sVm3QdE0

Andreas

HermannSW

#9
May 04, 2016, 01:55 am Last Edit: May 04, 2016, 01:57 am by HermannSW
Thanks Andreas, you made a good point in the comparison, I just did compute the ESP8266-12E (nodemcu dev board) numbers with Arduino IDE 1.6.4. This is the current table:
model-Os-O3
101
Due548494
MKR1000
Zero
ESP8266-12E612304


"-O3" does make a great difference for ESP8266-12E.

Can you please provide the numbers for the MKR1000?

Hermann.

HermannSW

#10
May 04, 2016, 03:43 pm Last Edit: May 04, 2016, 09:35 pm by HermannSW
nathancamp provided both Arduino 101 numbers here.

This is the updated table while waiting for MKR1000 and Arduino Zero numbers:
model-Os-O3speedprocessorWifi
10184679132MHzIntel® Curie-
Due54849484MHzATSAM3X8E-
MKR100048MHzSAMD21 Cortex-M0+yes
Zero48MHzATSAMD21G18-
ESP8266-12E61230480MHzTensilica Xtensa LX106yes


Hermann.

HermannSW

#11
Jun 03, 2016, 10:10 pm Last Edit: Jun 03, 2016, 10:12 pm by HermannSW
I did contact Andreas (sensorsiot) and asked whether he could determine the numbers for the MKR1000, and he did -- thanks Andreas!

This is the updated table, and since MKR1000 and Arduino Zero seem to have very similar SAMD21... microcontrollers the table can be considered complete:
model-Os-O3speedprocessorWifi
10184679132MHzIntel® Curie-
Due54849484MHzATSAM3X8E-
MKR1000103882548MHzSAMD21 Cortex-M0+yes
Zero--48MHzATSAMD21G18-
ESP8266-12E61230480MHzTensilica Xtensa LX106yes
Summary:
The Arduino Due outperforms the other >16MHz Arduinos integer compute power wise, and is only beaten by the ESP8266-12E.


Hermann.

ArthurD

#12
Jun 04, 2016, 03:09 pm Last Edit: Jun 04, 2016, 03:10 pm by ArthurD
here I did benchmarks about several tests, both low level and high-level API, and it's clear to see the advantages of the DUE and different ARM-based boards.
Unfortunately the documentation of the libs and the ARM-compatibility is a nightmare!

http://www.mindstormsforum.de/viewtopic.php?f=71&t=8095#p64772

(second chart table)

ArthurD

#13
Jun 04, 2016, 03:28 pm Last Edit: Jun 05, 2016, 06:05 pm by ArthurD
a suggestion for improving and simplifying this board:
for the future, please remove the built-in i2c pullups!!
and please implement completely ANSI C / stdio.h compatible libs
- for USB host to HID keyboards (getchar, gets,...)
- and for reading/writing SD files (fopen, fprintf, fscanf, fgets, fclose...)
plus libs for pre-emptive multitasking similar to pthread or to C++11 std::thread !

westfw

Quote
for the future, please remove the built-in i2c pullups!!
I don't see any i2c pullups on the board.  Are you complaining that the library enables them in the chip?  That should be easy enough to change (but why?)


Quote
and please implement completely ANSI C / stdio.h compatible libs [for keyboards and SD cards]
plus libs for pre-emptive multitasking similar to pthread or to C++11 std::thread !
Those don't sounds very Arduino-like.  Presumably they're not hard to add, since the Due code is newlib-based (ie file system code exists, but it's not used, nor are the low-level drivers for any HW implemented.)


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