Arduino Forum

Topics => Device Hacking => Topic started by: encryptor on Dec 06, 2012, 11:57 pm

Title: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: encryptor on Dec 06, 2012, 11:57 pm
How would I create a spark with the arduino?  Can you hack a grill ignitor or model rocket launch controller?  I'm thinking to recreate the Zeppelin blimp, but with flame retardant paper shell.  I was thinking to fill with hydrogen by a foil and hydrochloric acid  mix leading up to the blimp interior.  
Then either by a timed delay or RC control cause an internal combustion inside the blimp to see what the end result would be.  what if the design works, proven a new shell material could bring back the hydrogen blimp! Can I break a small light bulb and burn the tungsten coil thru a digital pin?  :P


http://www.hobbylinc.com/Model_Rocket_Launch_Controller
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: billroy on Dec 07, 2012, 12:05 am
SparkFun, perhaps not surprisingly, sells sparks: https://www.sparkfun.com/products/11218

-br
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: encryptor on Dec 07, 2012, 12:31 am
Nice, that rocks!  It looks dangerous if it pulls 3 amps
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: billroy on Dec 07, 2012, 12:37 am
It does sound quite impressive.  Not for direct connection to an arduino pin, at that level of current.  Search the forum and read up on driving high-current peripherals with a transistor or FET, or even a relay, which itself will require a transistor.

-br
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: retrolefty on Dec 07, 2012, 12:44 am
And of course also a DC power source capable of 3 amps or more. I want one but I don't yet know it I want one for $15.  :D

Lefty
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: cr0sh on Dec 07, 2012, 06:20 am

I was thinking to fill with hydrogen by a foil and hydrochloric acid  mix leading up to the blimp interior.


If you do this, don't fill it with hydrogen in this manner. And please don't light it off. Why?

Because what you are describing is basically a kind of poisonous gas bomb; the reaction of hydrochloric acid with aluminium basically creates hydrogen and chlorine gas via an exothermic reaction (that is, the reaction gets hot - very hot). In fact, left to its own devices, with enough aluminium and a high enough concentration of HCl, it will self-ignite. It's actually a commonly known "anarchist's cookbook" type of device (though usually done in a capped-off 2 liter bottle, with a burning candle or flare on top - nothing like burning plastic shrapnel and chlorine gas to get your blood going!).

Likely, you wouldn't poison yourself, but you might make yourself sick, eye irritation (or worse), etc - such a mix is very nasty stuff...


Then either by a timed delay or RC control cause an internal combustion inside the blimp to see what the end result would be.


Well - if all you had inside the gas envelope was hydrogen - absolutely nothing would happen, because you need oxygen mixed in the right amount in order for it to combust...
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: jabbado on Dec 07, 2012, 08:10 am

If you do this, don't fill it with hydrogen in this manner.

I agree. Although we used to fill 75 liter garbage bags using a slightly different (but just as dangerous) reaction. Everything was weighed accurately and cold water baths used to control the reaction rate. But I studied chemistry so was aware of the dangers, and what was the quickest way to the shower, and to the hospital. Still a silly thing to do.

BTW, hydrogen will ignite over a huge range of O2 concentrations. Even a few percent of oxygen could likely turn your blimp into a bomb.
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: encryptor on Dec 07, 2012, 04:54 pm
oh shit that does sound dangerous just mixing the 2 items aluminum and hydrocloric acid.  I've once did it ouside in a glass flash.  I'm not sure if it was enough to inflate a balloon completely.  I won't do that, however a gas filled blimp that exploded would be cool caught on video!  the dangerous by-produce of chlorine gas I wouldn't worry about too much because the experiment would be outside and we would be plenty aware of the gas.  At a higher height no one should be affected. :*

do you guys think Spark Gap ignitor create a spark hot enough to lite a medium sized bottle rocket or even a model rocket engine???  How cool would it be to have a model airplane that could shoot bottle rockets by IR control!  ^_^
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: graynomad on Dec 08, 2012, 01:03 am
I used to use small light bulbs (6 or 12v) with the glass broken/removed to set various things off. The filament gets red or even white hot then burns out. Not a spark but may be good enough.

______
Rob
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: encryptor on Dec 09, 2012, 12:16 am
i was curious about that.
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: Osgeld on Dec 11, 2012, 02:40 am
model rocket electric matches, or 100VDC and 20 amps will make a large spark and a smoldering pile where your AVR once lived
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: encryptor on Dec 11, 2012, 02:48 pm
ahh! :smiley-roll-blue:
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: focalist on Dec 11, 2012, 04:48 pm
Electrolysis of water is a MUCH safer method to produce hydrogen.. and oxygen for that matter.  Capture off the electrodes, and you can harvest nearly pure gases.  Best of all, you know you have a proper mix of hydrogen and oxygen, as your source and endpoints- water- are the same.  Energy stored in the chemical bonds is everything else..  In addition, it's pretty impressive once you think about it.  It will take quite a while to generate a good volume of gases.. depending on setup, hours or even days.  All the energy being dumped in to break the water chemical bonds over all that time... and when ignited, all that energy is released in a fraction of a second.  Electrolysis and combustion is a great hands-on example for demonstrating chemical storage of energy!

That all being said, I think you need to read a few things:

"The flammability limits based on the volume percent of hydrogen in air at 14.7 psia (1 atm, 101 kPa) are 4.0 and 75.0. The flammability limits based on the volume percent of hydrogen in oxygen at 14.7 psia (1 atm, 101 kPa) are 4.0 and 94.0."
"The limits of detonability of hydrogen in air are 18.3 to 59 percent by volume"[4]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_safety

Don't underestimate the power of the explosive you are dealing with.  This is NOT a safe project-- take EXTREME care... and if you have any doubts at ALL, do not do it.  You are essentially building a bomb if you try to contain detonating fuel/air vapor.  Even if explosion is avoided, the flame jet (which is invisible) will ignite ANYTHING it's close to- it will be a high-powered, invisible blowtorch (gas-fueled rocket?).  In either case, very dangerous. 
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: retrolefty on Dec 11, 2012, 05:12 pm
Quote
Electrolysis and combustion is a great hands-on example for demonstrating chemical storage of energy!


Ah, but much more dramatic demonstrations of storage and release of energy can be had playing with strong nuclear forces rather then your wimpy chemical bonds.  ]:)

Lefty
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: focalist on Dec 11, 2012, 05:15 pm
My plan is to create a device which creates a galactic-scale black hole centered on me, which will go off the moment I die.  I may even opt for a full blown Gnab gib.

I'm taking it ALL with me.  Whoever said you can't obviously hasn't understood my plans, which include laser sharks and a domed island from which I will rule with an iron fist.
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: arduinohabib on Jan 02, 2013, 01:56 am
When you short-circuit a 9v battery with a ball of steel wool, it burns very quickly. You can get a few strands from the steel wool and get a 9v battery and drive that with a MOSFET. It's simple and cheep.
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: trendski on Jan 28, 2013, 04:33 pm
Have a look at this I made for remotely firing fireworks. I used an arduino to control a relay and nichrome wire.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=LdICz38Yft4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=LdICz38Yft4)

All the information needed including videos and circuits is on the blog.

http://gampageek.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/normal-0-false-false-false-en-gb-x-none.html (http://gampageek.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/normal-0-false-false-false-en-gb-x-none.html)
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: encryptor on Jan 28, 2013, 08:04 pm
There are 2 relays on the Arduino Motor shield right?  How much current to you send to a Talon Igniter?  I read at least 12v on Amazon.  The Talon Igniter looks like a 1 time use?  That would be ideal, but not offered in smaller quantity and at a fair price! 8)

http://www.amazon.com/100pcs-2MFireworks-Firing-System-Igniter/dp/B00A5ZMWU6/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1359400482&sr=8-1&keywords=Talon+Igniter
Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: trendski on Jan 28, 2013, 09:02 pm
I don't think there are any relays on the standard arduino motor shield, it uses H-bridges on a chip.

You can use an arduino pin to get a transistor to trigger a relay. The relay can then switch 9v (say 2 Amps) this can make thin nichrome wire glow hot. Wrap the nichrome wire around a match (non safety type) and you have a homemade igniter. You could use a mosfet instead of a relay.

Title: Re: Create a spark or burning coil with Arduino
Post by: michinyon on Feb 08, 2013, 12:03 pm
Quote
Quote
the reaction of hydrochloric acid with aluminium basically creates hydrogen and chlorine gas via an exothermic reaction


Or maybe not.   If you add aluminum to hydrochloric acid,  you usually get hydrogen gas and a solution of aluminium chloride.....  but the chemistry in your country may differ.