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Topic: Figuring out terminals of washing machine motor (Read 1 time) previous topic - next topic

kivig

Apr 01, 2013, 12:24 am Last Edit: Apr 01, 2013, 12:27 am by kivig Reason: 1
Hi,
I need a powerful motor to move some heavy things.
Not yet sure if I'm lucky, but I've got a motor and a huge 25uf capacitor from what could be called vintage washing machine.
The machine could be powered by two (not three) or single phase.
The machine operated motor in slow mode in both directions, and in fast mode.
I'm trying to figure out how to connect the motor now.
The motor has 5 terminals in connector. After measuring resistances in between it seems it's organized like this (measured, not actual resistances):

Being completely new to induction motors, I've red the Wikipedia article and understood that I do need the capacitor :) But the motor seems to be the mix of more than one type and I have no idea what is safe to try or how it should be connected.

outofoptions

#1
Apr 01, 2013, 01:02 am Last Edit: Apr 01, 2013, 01:04 am by outofoptions Reason: 1
I did appliance repair for many years but the last 20 of my time for one company so I'm limited to what I know in general terms.  If it is "vintage" you should be able to find the information on line.  Who manufactured it?

Generally the low resistance winding was the 'start' winding. 

kivig

#2
Apr 01, 2013, 02:02 am Last Edit: Apr 01, 2013, 02:12 am by kivig Reason: 1

I did appliance repair for many years but the last 20 of my time for one company so I'm limited to what I know in general terms.  If it is "vintage" you should be able to find the information on line.  Who manufactured it?

Generally the low resistance winding was the 'start' winding. 

It seems it should be VØLUND ELMATIC 401, but Google gives hardly any info at all on that.
BTW the machine program was encoded in an array of discs, having notches which pressed contacts while slowly rotating. Now that's a macro-controller :)

MarkT

Brushed or induction?  I have a feeling they are quite complex since they have to do slow, fast and both directions.
[ I won't respond to messages, use the forum please ]

kivig


Brushed or induction?  I have a feeling they are quite complex since they have to do slow, fast and both directions.

As far as I can see there is no brushes of any kind.
Probably. Also there is a chance it might have something to do with being able to run from two phases (if it was related to motor at all).

I wonder what and how could it be safe to test.
Would it burn right away if I power one of windings?
Could I use a resistor, like 500w heater connected in series to be able to see the effect of different windings without burning something?

MarkT

Well as I said it is complicated - may be series or parallel wound with several different windings - if you have the
original washing m/c that should offer some clues.   Dummy load like a 50W tungsten light bulb would be safer,
500W is a lot of heat.
[ I won't respond to messages, use the forum please ]

kivig

Thanks, a bulb indeed should be safer.
I'll try that tomorrow - don't want to wake anyone up if something goes out of control :)

jackrae

You talk about 2-phase.  Do you mean 2 phases plus a neutral from a 3-phase system or do you mean 220 supply rather than 110 as the USA uses.  If the latter then I'm sorry to advise that it's still single phase even if running at 220.

kivig

#8
Apr 02, 2013, 12:04 pm Last Edit: Apr 02, 2013, 12:12 pm by kivig Reason: 1

You talk about 2-phase.  Do you mean 2 phases plus a neutral from a 3-phase system or do you mean 220 supply rather than 110 as the USA uses.  If the latter then I'm sorry to advise that it's still single phase even if running at 220.

1 phase - 220V
2 phases - 380V. It's a system specific to Dutch (I hope I don't mix countries :) ) network, not sure how they manage it.

JimboZA

Older houses in Johannesburg have two phases as well... my late father-in-law served his electrical apprenticeship with the Jo'burg Council and it was common way back. It's actually two separate 220vac phases, through two council meters, and apparently was just to try to balance the council's load. Electric stove, for instance, should be on both phases, perhaps oven on one, plates on other, kind of thing. Stoves are supplied with 3 lines and one neutral connection, and a pic showing how to jumper the lines together for 1 or 2 phases.

But when all said and done it's just two single phase supplies to one property.

Not done any more...

Arduino ethernet server here.... http://jimboza.gotdns.com:8085/

No PMs for help please

kivig


It's actually two separate 220vac phases, through two council meters, and apparently was just to try to balance the council's load. Electric stove, for instance, should be on both phases, perhaps oven on one, plates on other, kind of thing. Stoves are supplied with 3 lines and one neutral connection, and a pic showing how to jumper the lines together for 1 or 2 phases.

Same here except voltage. I saved the pic, it says 380V.

kivig

#11
Apr 03, 2013, 08:21 pm Last Edit: Apr 03, 2013, 08:26 pm by kivig Reason: 1
Ok, I've connected it like this and it seems to work:


Except it works in "slow mode". After belt drive reduction it should be the machine's normal washing speed.
Which seems strange, I was expecting full rpms (of what would be the centrifugal mode) requiring some magic on remaining windings to slow down.
If I connect one or both of remaining windings to phase before or after capacitor the motor slows down to a various degrees and produces various patterns of buzzing.
Moving neutral to one of additional windings produces no really noticeable effect.
I wonder how to get it to full RPM - there was not much of other components in the machine and it did had the centrifugal mode.

kivig

Could it be normal that the motor gets hot after couple of minutes of idle operation?
Under almost stopping friction load it gets hot in about 30-60 seconds.
By hot I mean about 48 degrees in hotspots on relatively thin cast iron cylinder.
What could be considered a safe temperature margin?

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