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Author Topic: breadboard atmega 328 oscilator not working, Why???  (Read 1840 times)
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hello I  just bought:

2x atmega 328P-PU
4x ceramic resonator
5x crystal oscillator
both 16MHz
and
100x 22pF capacitor
E6 resistor kit
(so if i got any of the components that were faulty i would have no problem replacing them)

I hooked up my breadboard exactly the way it said here (http://arduino.cc/en/Tutorial/ArduinoToBreadboard)
Ive checked all the posts i could find on google, forums, everywhere, i also find that lot of people had the same problem, tried their solutions, nothing worked.

First i tried hooking up resonator pin(9, 10) and middle pin to GND, i checked with oscilloscope and i couldn't get any oscillations out of it, i tried replacing 328 with another one, still nothing, i tried 4 different resonators nothing.
Than i hooked up crystal resonator with 22pF capacitors on pin 9 and 10, again looked at oscilloscope, still couldn't get any oscillations, i switched again chip, oscillator, capacitors, still no oscillations.
than i solder all the components on a protoboard the same way i hooked them up on breadboard, than i repeated the switching of components process all over again, still nothing.

Than i thought maybe my oscilloscope is broken ( getting desperate) , i calibrated the probes with 1kHz signal which i get from frequency generator on scope, and it worked fine.
than i thought maybe it is not fast enough. so i hooked it up to 24MHz clock signal which i have on atmel 8051 and i could see the signal nicely, so this is not the problem.

I find it hard to believe that all the components that i bought are faulty, so i must be missing something, but what?
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Have you burned the Arduino bootloader?

A factory fresh ATmega chip uses the internal 8MHz oscillator and a /8 prescaler so it runs at 1MHz.  As part of the Arduino bootloader burning process the chip is re-configured to use the external crystal/resonator.  I don't think you will see the crystal being used until those configuration fuses are set.
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A couple of random thoughts.

First a scope probe on the oscillator pins can load down the oscillator circuit such that it doesn't display correctly or even prevent oscillation. I have tried to use my analog Tek scope with a x10 probe and only see about 1/2 volt peak-to-peak clock signals.

If your 328P chips are in factory blank condition then it's normally has it's internal fuse bits set such that the internal 8 mhz clock is enabled and it won't utilize any external clock components even if wired up. If you bought chips that have the bootloader preinstalled then the fuse settings should be proper for use with external 16Mhz crystal or resonator to work.

Using a hardware programmer and uploading the arduino bootloader code into the chip via the ICSP pins also sets the fuse bits to utilize an external 16mhz crystal or resonator.

Lefty
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ok, i am trying  to burn the bootloader now, but am having different problems, which i have not investigated yet,

i am using a paralell programmer from (http://arduino.cc/en/Hacking/ParallelProgrammer?from=Main.ParallelProgrammer)

avrdude: AVR device not responding
avrdude: initialization failed, rc=-1
avrdude: Yikes!  Invalid device signature.
avrdude: Expected signature for ATMEGA328P is 1E 95 0F
avrdude: AVR device not responding
 ***failed;  
avrdude: verification error, first mismatch at byte 0x0000
         0xd9 != 0xff
avrdude: verification error; content mismatch
« Last Edit: March 31, 2011, 10:35:23 am by zigaRupret » Logged

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I hooked up my breadboard exactly the way it said here (http://arduino.cc/en/Tutorial/ArduinoToBreadboard)
ok, i am trying  to burn the bootloader now, but am having different problems, which i have not investigated yet,
i am using a paralell programmer from (http://arduino.cc/en/Hacking/ParallelProgrammer?from=Main.ParallelProgrammer)

If you are connecting your breadboard to an Arduino running ArduinoISP, like in the first page, what are you doing with the Parallel Programmer?!?
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sorry i guess i was not completely accurate (i tried to be)
so i bought 328P-PU blank chips.
i would like to use 16MHz oscillators with them and program them with serial cable. if i understood correctly, you only need to burn Audion bootloader once than you can load programs using normal serial cable. i do not have AVR programmer or any other Audion platforms, so my only option to burn the bootloader would be using parallel programmer.
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you only need to burn Audion bootloader once than you can load programs using normal serial cable.

Well only if you have an RS232 to TTL converter on the end of the serial cable.

Anyway it looks like there is something wrong with your parallel programmer or your circuit.

That first link you posted is about doing the same job that the parallel programmer does so I think you are mixing something up here.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2011, 05:56:11 pm by Grumpy_Mike » Logged

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Why is that people are spending serious money on Arduino starter packs, stuff from apple and fast-food, but completely fail to see that spending a mere 20-35€ for a dedicated ISP programmer is the best thing for their (and our) mental sanity in the long run? And how long did it take to actually build this parallel port contraption, which will become instantly useless once a new computer without such a port is used.

In the time it takes to read threads similar to this and literally worm the information out of the questioner, I could have setup and flashed a blank chip many times.

I understand that keeping Arduino boards 'simple' by having a bootloader might look a good find on first glance, but all this trouble... I wonder if it would have been possible to use the usb-avr on the new uno + a switch to select between normal usb-serial mode and usb-isp mode and get rid of all of this nonsense once and for all. Programmers can be auto-selected by the definitions in 'boards.txt', so there shouldn't have been any back-compatibility issues. Old boards would be treated as before. And for the new ones: No accidental erasing of the code, no auto-reset problems when opening the serial port for just talking to the board AND if the chip is dead, just pop in a new one, switch to usb-isp mode, burn the fuses and be done with it. Too difficult for new users? I think not! People can deal with fancy cell-phones, digital cameras and the likes as well...

/rant
« Last Edit: March 31, 2011, 07:08:10 pm by madworm » Logged

• Upload doesn't work? Do a loop-back test.
• There's absolutely NO excuse for not having an ISP!
• Your AVR needs a brain surgery? Use the online FUSE calculator.
My projects: RGB LED matrix, RGB LED ring, various ATtiny gadgets...
• Microsoft is not the answer. It is the question, and the answer is NO!

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Too difficult for new users?
In the quest to keep things simple for the non-technical user they seem to have forgotten to keep things simple in terms of the hardware.

Don
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well i kind of solved the problem.
i was googling the whole day and find that the problem must be in parallel programmer or on computer side(WinXP SP3), and that nobody actually solved the problem.

i threw away the parallel port and order a professional programmer, since this is not solvable
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well i kind of solved the problem.
i was googling the whole day and find that the problem must be in parallel programmer or on computer side(WinXP SP3), and that nobody actually solved the problem.

i threw away the parallel port and order a professional programmer, since this is not solvable

I came to the same conclusion several years ago. After fighting with a homebrew parallel programmer, I gave up and burned it up in the back yard (well I felt like it) and spend $19 for a USBtiny hardware programmer kit from Adafruit. It is supported directly by the arduino IDE and works great first time and every time sense.


Lefty

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is the USBtiny a good programmer? i mean in the sens of capability to programmer other devices, because i am under the expression that usb tiny is good only for programming arduinos, i have not dig in to details of programing microchips, but i hop i am buying good and versatile stuff? AVR programmer is capable of programming other chips.
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It should work with all AVR chips that support ISP programming, which is most of the ATtiny chips and the ATmega chips. I don't know about the ATxmega ones and AVR32 chips. If you're shooting for those, better get the 35$ one from Atmel.

With my usbtiny I've been successful in programming these chips so far:

ATmega168, ATmega64, ATtiny24, ATtiny2313, ATtiny4313, ATmega32, ATtiny13
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• Upload doesn't work? Do a loop-back test.
• There's absolutely NO excuse for not having an ISP!
• Your AVR needs a brain surgery? Use the online FUSE calculator.
My projects: RGB LED matrix, RGB LED ring, various ATtiny gadgets...
• Microsoft is not the answer. It is the question, and the answer is NO!

Left Coast, CA (USA)
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is the USBtiny a good programmer? i mean in the sens of capability to programmer other devices, because i am under the expression that usb tiny is good only for programming arduinos, i have not dig in to details of programing microchips, but i hop i am buying good and versatile stuff? AVR programmer is capable of programming other chips.

The USBtiny programmer is defined in current AVRDUDE configuration file so you can program any chip that your version of AVRDUDE has defined, which is a lot. Command line mode of AVRDUDE using USBtiny programmer is as capable as any other combination of software/hardware that I'm aware of as far as burning programs using ICSP.

Lefty
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