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Topic: Perpetual Hydro energy loop (Read 5 times) previous topic - next topic

MikMo

Hydro electric plants are not closed systems, the rely on the energi in a river or waterfall or whatever as an EXTERNAl source of energy.

I you read the wiki article posted above the difference is explained.

eddiea6987

http://zimmer.csufresno.edu/~fringwal/stoopid.lis

I like this one :

"Heavier than air flying machines are impossible."
   -- Lord Kelvin

"There is not the slightest indication that nuclear energy will be
obtainable."
   -- Albert Einstein, 1932
I could print the Arduino logo on a box of cereal and sell it as "Arduin-O's"

eddiea6987

Quote
Hydro electric plants are not closed systems, the rely on the energi in a river or waterfall or whatever as an EXTERNAl source of energy.

I you read the wiki article posted above the difference is explained.


Yes i read the article right after i posted that
I could print the Arduino logo on a box of cereal and sell it as "Arduin-O's"

radman

Quote
"In this house, we obey the Laws of Thermodynamics"
Homer J. Simpson
Did Homer really say that?

Most of our systems get their energy directly or indirectly from the sun. With Hydro it is energy from the sun that powers the weather systems that lift the water into the mountains to fill rivers. Hydro stations and dams extract some of that energy.

If you want a lot of energy what you need is a 2m receiver and about 1km of 1cm wide copper wire. Build a Dyson-Harrop satellite and it will give you 1027Watts of power. Roughly a billion, billion gigawatts.

AWOL

Quote
Most of our systems get their energy directly or indirectly from the sun

Psst, radman, see reply #12

And, yes, Homer did say that.
"Pete, it's a fool looks for logic in the chambers of the human heart." Ulysses Everett McGill.
Do not send technical questions via personal messaging - they will be ignored.

GoForSmoke


Quote
Eddie, the pump is *much* less than 100% efficient as is the turbine and the generator. Some, less than 50% efficient. At each step you lose energy so where does the extra come from? Wishful thinking?


Ok, but wouldn't the gears make up for the loss of efficiency? I could get gears to turn the generators who knows how many more times then the turbine
AND  multiple generators??? all with the same pumps, heck even add another turbine ...


Sorry Eddie but efficient as gears are they still lose some of what is used to turn them to friction.
Every thing you add, every extra generator, pump, every physical device loses you a bit more power.

If you want to generate energy then you need to find an energy source, like wind or water flow, and tap that. The more direct and simple you do that, the more power you should get out.

So for example if you want to lift water using wind power it is better to run a pump or bucket chain directly from your windmill than to generate electricity with the windmill and use that to run an electric motor to drive a pump or bucket chain. The generator alone might lose you 40% of the wind power, the electric motor lose 40% of what's left while gears or pulleys from the windmill directly to the pump might lose 10%, less if well done. Even then, either way, the pump takes more power than it puts out.

The closest thing to magic you can get or do is to make something a bit more efficient but no one in all history has made any machine 100% efficient. There is always loss either from friction, partial energy transfer, or both.

I won't bother quoting laws of thermodynamics to you but the above is just a common sense way to say the same. Now it's up to you to see common sense or find it out yourself.

Nick Gammon on multitasking Arduinos:
1) http://gammon.com.au/blink
2) http://gammon.com.au/serial
3) http://gammon.com.au/interrupts

eddiea6987

Interesting GoForSmoke didnt think about friction and all those goodies.

Quote
If you want a lot of energy what you need is a 2m receiver and about 1km of 1cm wide copper wire. Build a Dyson-Harrop satellite and it will give you 1027Watts of power. Roughly a billion, billion gigawatts.


Is that even possible? has it been tried? I mean if they can throw money to build a Hadron collider , and bail freddie and fannie  then why not throw money on something to help the earth out ..?
I shall seek funding ;)
I could print the Arduino logo on a box of cereal and sell it as "Arduin-O's"

GoForSmoke


http://zimmer.csufresno.edu/~fringwal/stoopid.lis

I like this one :

"Heavier than air flying machines are impossible."
   -- Lord Kelvin

"There is not the slightest indication that nuclear energy will be
obtainable."
   -- Albert Einstein, 1932


Does quoting other people's mistaken views tell you how to make something work? They were wrong about -something, ever- so you must be right?



Nick Gammon on multitasking Arduinos:
1) http://gammon.com.au/blink
2) http://gammon.com.au/serial
3) http://gammon.com.au/interrupts

AWOL

#23
Oct 29, 2011, 05:26 pm Last Edit: Oct 29, 2011, 05:29 pm by AWOL Reason: 1
Another useful search term is 'over unity'

You can't win.
You can't break even.
You can't quit the game.

And the Zeroth law: You must play the game.
"Pete, it's a fool looks for logic in the chambers of the human heart." Ulysses Everett McGill.
Do not send technical questions via personal messaging - they will be ignored.

eddiea6987

Quote
They were wrong about -something, ever- so you must be right?


But your doing the same thing..quoting laws  , so i must be wrong?

those peoples views where wrong because of  "laws" they thought to be true, maybe your in the same boat
I could print the Arduino logo on a box of cereal and sell it as "Arduin-O's"

eddiea6987

the whole idea of quoting them was that because of  the knowledge available in their time they made some erroneous statements, times change technology and discoveries advance, could we not agree something YOU see as impossible today me be possible in the future? I cannot blame you for being a man of your time. 
I could print the Arduino logo on a box of cereal and sell it as "Arduin-O's"

zoomkat

Quote
I shall seek funding


Hey, I can help you here!!! I have a very secret project funding system called "The World Wide Money Spinner" where you get in early on the ground level by investing all the funds you have available or can borrow, and with in months your investment will grow 100x. This must be kept secret to prevent the idea from being stolen by big business or oppressed by the anti-capitalistic government. you have been chosen as I see you are very savy to these new and creative ideas and approaches!
Consider the daffodil. And while you're doing that, I'll be over here, looking through your stuff.   8)

radman

eddiea6987 you are taking the Mickey aren't you?

Lord Kelvin and Albert Einstein were expressing their opinions, not stating that things were impossible because of scientific laws.
Perpetual motion is a very seductive idea and when people come up with elaborate schemes it can be hard to see where the flaw lies.There is always a flaw though. When people promote such schemes they often seem to be trying to get money.

You must see that if you attach an electric motor to a generator which produces power to run the motor it is just not going to work not now or ever. Not even if you give the the system a bit of a start with a battery.

The Dyson-Harrop satellite, unlike perpetual motion machines, will work. There are just one or two technical problems to fix. However the potential profits are truly astronomical as just one unit will produce about one hundred billion times the power used on Earth at the moment. The "World Wide Money Spinner" fund run by Zoomcat is financing a prototype would you like to invest and benefit from getting in at the start? Keep it quite though we don't want competition.


justone

I think this has already been accomplished by this fellow:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYovDvyheZ4

AWOL

Perhaps Einstein had an ulterior motive, to put the Nazis off the scent.
Flight wasn't Kelvin's forte.
"Pete, it's a fool looks for logic in the chambers of the human heart." Ulysses Everett McGill.
Do not send technical questions via personal messaging - they will be ignored.

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