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Topic: that fun time of year... (rolling eyes) (Read 440 times) previous topic - next topic

MattS-UK

The Gulf Stream does add some warmth to Britain.
The recieved wisdom is that the UKs compartively mild climate is driven by the Ocean current but when you put aside the popularisation, by the press and the movie, The Day After Tomorrow, the science doesn't appear to support it.

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And look at the map, the Gulf Stream warms those waters just a measured bit.
About +2C (Winter) to +7C (Summer) between the English Channel and North Sea.

It was interesting diving the Azores, as a 40 mile RHIB ride took us over the border of the current.  +7C shift in water temperature in the vastly deeper Atlantic waters offshore of the islands, entirely counter intutive to what I had come to expect.  

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I don't recall trying to claim what that article takes aim at. But I do know that it doesn't take much to make a real difference.
The article aims to debunk a commonly held myth.  It turns out the Rocky mountains [sp] have far more to do with the climate in London than North Atlantic drift.

It actually takes a huge differential to have much effect on North Atlantic sea temperatures, due to the volume of the Ocean and the density of salt water.  For the 20 years I was diving, the annual max and min sea temperatures in the Channel, did not vary by as much as one degree C.  What does change are the months the extremes occur in, which fall in phase with the relative variation of Air temperature and particularly, the location of high altitude winds to the North of Scotland (also called the Gulf Stream).

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On the upside, Britain might see more sun, less rain.
Sadly I doubt it.  The trend in my lifetime has been toward greater extremes with longer periods of dark and damp cloud cover in between.  The gap between Britain and Europe has not only widened politically but geographically too, as large chunks of coastline have been washed away by floods.  Anyhow, I fully expect the incoming administration to build a wall around the Rockies and charge the UK for the additional warmth :D


GoForSmoke

#31
Jan 17, 2017, 07:49 pm Last Edit: Jan 17, 2017, 07:53 pm by GoForSmoke
Sadly I doubt it.  The trend in my lifetime has been toward greater extremes with longer periods of dark and damp cloud cover in between. 
I've been watching it happen since I was 15 and winter took a 2 week vacation in early February. That was winter 71-72. It's been a while but so far the latency of the big ice and oceans has kept the worst from showing. Every real sign shows that it will be sooner than is politically acceptable.
Over 40 years so far, I hope to not see the worst (starting with WWIII) coming up. I expect WWIII with the politics of hate, fear and power steadily ratcheting up. The people with the most to lose seem hell-bent to create the very conditions where they will. The kid who dies with the most toys is still dead!

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About +2C (Winter) to +7C (Summer) between the English Channel and North Sea.
Shallow water vs deep water with Arctic currents running deep into it.

I dunno about the channel. The main stream runs west of Britain (as the article shows) and delivers a lot of heat to the atmosphere, noting that heat and temperature are not the same thing. When the rain comes down, condensation requires the heat of evaporation released. That's the major warming mechanism, rain instead of ice..

When disproving over-claims and other fallacies it's good to not turn that into disproof of everything within sight of the fallacy.
Nick Gammon on multitasking Arduinos:
1) http://gammon.com.au/blink
2) http://gammon.com.au/serial
3) http://gammon.com.au/interrupts

MattS-UK

#32
Today at 11:06 am Last Edit: Today at 11:08 am by MattS-UK
I expect WWIII with the politics of hate, fear and power steadily ratcheting up. The people with the most to lose seem hell-bent to create the very conditions where they will. The kid who dies with the most toys is still dead!
The inequality epidemic will not go on indefinitely.  Reagan, Thatcher and Friedman have a lot to answer for in my estimation.  The problem with neo-liberalism is that it favours psychopaths and the problem with psychopaths is, as the name suggests, they are often psychotic.

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Shallow water vs deep water with Arctic currents running deep into it.
Scapa-flow is only ~50m deep.

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I dunno about the channel.
The Atlantic tide hits the Cornish peninsula and splits.  The English Channel is ~100m deep and with little to oppose the flood running West to East, we get relatively warmer sea temperatures all along the South Coast.  Along the West coast, the tide is toe to toe with colder waters flowing from the North.

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When disproving over-claims and other fallacies it's good to not turn that into disproof of everything within sight of the fallacy.
Good job no one said that then ;)  

The articles do not claim that Ocean currents have zero effect.  To do so would be disingenuous.  The articles seek to debunk the common belief, that Ocean currents are the dominant force.  It is a question of thermodynamics, surely?  Air currents would appear to have the significant advantage, being a much better insulator and moving faster than water.


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