Arduino Forum

Development => Suggestions for the Arduino Project => Topic started by: elico on Jun 03, 2012, 05:28 pm

Title: The Next Uno
Post by: elico on Jun 03, 2012, 05:28 pm
Hi all

I suggest that the next UNO will contain the following:

1> A way to burn the boot loader on a blank ATMega .
2> Several seven segments on board for experimenting and debugging .
3> all needed for shield connections.
4> Zif socket .
5> Several mini potentiometers for analog inputs .

The board will be in the right length and width for all this .

Thanks
Elico 
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: graynomad on Jun 04, 2012, 02:43 am
I can't see this in the next official Uno but as an extended development board I can see potential in something like this.

There is a shield from RuggedCircuits (http://ruggedcircuits.com/html/gadget_shield.html (http://ruggedcircuits.com/html/gadget_shield.html)) that does similar.

______
Rob
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: JimboZA on Jun 04, 2012, 05:00 am
Hmmm, now that does look interesting....

Jim
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: pjrc on Jun 04, 2012, 02:05 pm
Adding a ZIF socket, 7 segment displays (and presumably driver circuitry), and trimmer or small thumbwheel pots would significantly increase the Uno's price.
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: elico on Jun 04, 2012, 02:12 pm
And avoid many shields ..
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: kf2qd on Jun 04, 2012, 05:36 pm
Most of those would require more boad space and probably interfere with the use of I/O pins. Better to be put on a shield as not all designs need them. Keep the Arduino clean and simple to interface with. And a ZIF socket is just TOO BIG. Those functions can go on a simple shield, and would be a good first project for and Arduino noob.

I would suggest that tim7's Arduino Self ISP -  http://arduino.cc/forum/index.php/topic,101690.0.html - be added. Now that would be an improvement - Little added cost and a Standalone ISP with every Arduino.
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: cmiyc on Jun 05, 2012, 12:09 am
I'm sorry but with the exception of #1 I don't see these suggestions adding significant value.  Nor would I expect them be integrated into a board intended to appeal to a large audience.


1> A way to burn the boot loader on a blank ATMega .

This would be interesting if the on-board 16u2 could be jumpered or something.  However, I'm not sure the added complexity is worth it. 


2> Several seven segments on board for experimenting and debugging .

I don't think this would appeal to a wide audience.  Serial prints are far more effective and add no parts cost to the board.  7-segments aren't cheap in terms of cost or hardware resources.   How would they be connected?  Lots of trade odds for a feature few people have requested.


3> all needed for shield connections.

All what?


4> Zif socket

I think the size and cost of a ZIF socket isn't worth it.  In the 3+ years I've been working on Arduino projects, I've only changed the chip a couple of times. Depending on volume, I have seen ZIF sockets that cost more than the current Uno.  It isn't a small up charge.


5> Several mini potentiometers for analog inputs .

Again, this adds cost and complexity while only appealing to a small number of users.
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: graynomad on Jun 05, 2012, 01:38 am
I think what elico is suggesting is similar to the many processor evaluation boards around and as such I like the idea (maybe with provision for a bread board as well).

That said, every time I look at EVBs I find that they have too many things I don't want and not enough of what I do want, so it's probably near impossible to get the right mix of features.

______
Rob
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: nickgammon on Jun 05, 2012, 02:04 am
After watching the video about the making of Arduino, it seemed to me that the developers were trying to make something that could be used in schools/universities, which was cheaper than the other evaluation boards around (which were around $100). Remember if you have to buy 100 of them to outfit a classroom, the difference between $100 each and $30 each becomes quite large. It might be the difference between having your proposal to teach microprocessors rejected, rather than accepted.

Also, in practice, whatever you put on the board, either probably won't be needed, or there won't be enough of them. Put on one potentiometer? Someone will need two. Put on a 4-digit LED? Someone will need 6. Or none.

The idea of making a pretty "bare" board with provision for shields to plug in, seems to me to allow for expansion in all sorts of directions. Plus you can just run patch cables to a breadboard if you don't have the right shield to hand.
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: elico on Jun 05, 2012, 08:08 am
Also some miniature switches will be well come ..
Elico
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: CrossRoads on Jun 05, 2012, 09:32 pm
elico,
Come up with some better requirements:
What size 7-segment displays, (such as 0.56"),
What size buttons (such as 6mm x 6mm),
What size pots (such as ...)
How many of each?
Are the pins for those to be dedicated? Selected with user installed jumpers, or perhaps a DIP switch?
USB interface needed?
Does it need maintain Arduino shield compatibility?

"> A way to burn the boot loader on a blank ATMega" under an external PC control?

What you want is generally not difficult to do.
The bootloader has to be loaded on something (such as flash in a second smaller uC that can act as an external PC) by someone (such as the "factory")  to be available for downloading into a part (blank or otherwise) by driving the SPI/reset lines when a jumper/switch is selected at reset or similar.
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: jimLee on Jun 06, 2012, 08:48 am
No no nononono.. The uno is simple, its elegant. I love it that we can decide what -we- want by adding shields. Or not adding shields.

But I would like to loose the gigantic USB port for something smaller and more common.

-jim lee
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: elico on Jun 06, 2012, 09:03 am
Shanon

I came with the concept .
The exact details are to be chosen by the experts that are capable
to give life to my idea .

Elico

Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: elico on Jun 06, 2012, 09:45 am
If I may suggest a further change.

I would suggest a header pins version , meaning that the UNO will have down beneath header pins
for connecting to outer world components in a bread board or some vero board  instead of the cable pins
that are good for shields but not so good for integrating in a project that needs further
components connected to the UNO . 

Elico
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: JimboZA on Jun 06, 2012, 10:00 am


But I would like to loose the gigantic USB port for something smaller and more common.

-jim lee


A la the Leonardo, yep that would be nice....
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: westfw on Jun 06, 2012, 10:48 am
Sorta like http://www.mikroe.com/eng/products/view/5/easyavr5a/ ?  Not really to my tastes, and not cheap enough, but (IMO) a pretty good deal.

I'm with JimLee: there have been lots of AVR development boards before and after Arduino, with lots of additional features.   For one reason or another, none has received the acceptance of the Arduino.  Prior to Arduino, the "AVR Butterfly" was probably the closest thing; there were a bunch of nice tutorials written about it.  But when you look at trying to use it beyond the tutorials, it turns out that nearly all the pins are already connected to something, making it a bit of a pain to use.
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: graynomad on Jun 06, 2012, 11:42 am
Quote
I would suggest a header pins version

Just leave the connectors out and people can solder in what they want.

Quote
gigantic USB port

WHY oh WHY do they still use that stupid socket? Some people say for backwards compatibility, just buy a new bloody cable for $2 (as if we don't all have a 100 spare USB cables anyway).

______
Rob
Title: LAST HUMBLE SUGGESTION TO NEXT UNO.
Post by: elico on Jun 06, 2012, 01:54 pm
Call it EliDuino ...
If it will be implemented .

Thanks
Elico :)

Title: Re: LAST HUMBLE SUGGESTION TO NEXT UNO.
Post by: cmiyc on Jun 06, 2012, 02:48 pm

Call it EliDuino ...
If it will be implemented .

You can make it yourself.  Then you know it is implemented.
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: CrossRoads on Jun 07, 2012, 01:17 am
elico, look at these
http://store.nkcelectronics.com/arduino-pro-328--5328516.html
http://store.nkcelectronics.com/arduino-pro-mini-328--5328516.html
http://store.nkcelectronics.com/Arduino-Leonardo_p_360.html

Maybe just one of these for your project vs redesigning the card?
Title: Re: The Next Uno
Post by: elico on Jun 07, 2012, 10:16 am
Thanks
I will look into those later tonight  I hope .

Elico