Arduino Forum

Using Arduino => General Electronics => Topic started by: phibes4000 on Jan 28, 2011, 06:30 am

Title: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: phibes4000 on Jan 28, 2011, 06:30 am
Hi,

I usually use SeeedStudio for PCBs.  I need a board made in about 7-12 days and it seems every fab house is about to shut down.  I'm in Australia and the local options are ridiculous, US-based ones charge too much for shipping, and I haven't heard good things about Futurlec (Thailand) and Olimex (Eastern Europe).  Are there any good options in SE Asia etc that don't celebrate Chinese NY?  E.g. Thailand, Malaysia etc?

Otherwise I'll just wait...

Lee
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: retrolefty on Jan 28, 2011, 06:32 am
Quote
Are there any good options in SE Asia etc that don't celebrate Chinese NY?  E.g. Thailand, Malaysia etc?


Maybe Tibet ?   :D
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: phibes4000 on Jan 28, 2011, 06:38 am

Quote
Are there any good options in SE Asia etc that don't celebrate Chinese NY?  E.g. Thailand, Malaysia etc?


Maybe Tibet ?   :D

Nice one.   They  are 'encouraged' to celebrate it...

Wikipedia tells me Losar is on March 5 this year.  8 days before the ides of march...
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: graynomad on Jan 28, 2011, 08:31 am
I'm also in Aus and have just used PCBcart.com. I was very happy with them, they spotted a fault on the board and because I sent them the Altuim file (no pissing around with Gerbers) they fixed it for me.

But they're Chinese so that may be a problem.

______
Rob
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: TonyD on Jan 28, 2011, 11:03 am
Hi Lee

From my bookmarks here are some UK/European PCB houses:

http://www.pcbcart.com/

http://www.pcbexpress.com/

http://www.pcbtrain.co.uk/

http://www.pcb-pool.com/ppuk/index.html

http://www.quick-teck.co.uk/

http://www.tecbridgecircuits.co.uk/index.htm

http://www.multipcb.co.uk/
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: phibes4000 on Jan 28, 2011, 12:11 pm
Thanks for the above, they're either too expensive (esp with shipping - I'm in Aus), or actually in China (like PCBCart).  Unless I'm missing something, Olimex are quite expensive for 3 or so 100mm x 100mm boards, and seem to get mixed reviews.  Their website makes my head hurt.
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: thegeekway on Jan 28, 2011, 12:51 pm

Hi Lee

From my bookmarks here are some UK/European PCB houses:

http://www.pcbcart.com/

http://www.pcbexpress.com/

http://www.pcbtrain.co.uk/

http://www.pcb-pool.com/ppuk/index.html

http://www.quick-teck.co.uk/

http://www.tecbridgecircuits.co.uk/index.htm
http://www.multipcb.co.uk/



PCB cart and tecbridge both use chinese fab houses. :)
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: liuzengqiang on Jan 28, 2011, 06:39 pm
Off topic warning: read at your own risk of distraction! ]:)

Yes, for the past 1,000 years they have only been encouraged. Still fairly new land compare with some of rest of the lands that have been China some 4 to 5 thousand years ago.

Actually most of people in Tibet had no choice what to celebrate, since they were slaves till 1950, when the communists drove their masters away, Da Lai La Ma being one of the biggest ones, interesting what a person he grew up to be from a slave master :)

BTW, I thought only X-mas delays PCB orders as there are many cheap toys that western countries demand around that time. The Chinese don't buy as many cheap toys for their holidays. They stay home and eat good meals.



Quote
Are there any good options in SE Asia etc that don't celebrate Chinese NY?  E.g. Thailand, Malaysia etc?


Maybe Tibet ?   :D

Nice one.   They  are 'encouraged' to celebrate it...

Wikipedia tells me Losar is on March 5 this year.  8 days before the ides of march...
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: westfw on Jan 28, 2011, 08:34 pm
Quote
Too bad they get so much negative press

Modern cultures tend to rate other cultures on the "good things" they have "failed to achieve", rather than on the evils that they successfully lessened.  It reminds me of an exchange in one of my favorite SF series: "They don't have [Internet] access?  That's one of the most fundamental aspects of the [] constitution - that freedom of access to information shall not be restricted!" "Well, they're more worried about food and fresh water, and a safe place to sleep."  Yeah.

Eventually, this makes everyone look awful.  We won't be happy till we've taken every historical hero and dissected their actions and personal foibles and completely recast them as villains.  And then we won't be happy because we don't have any heroes left.
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: TerryKing on Jan 28, 2011, 09:44 pm

...
Eventually, this makes everyone look awful.  We won't be happy till we've taken every historical hero and dissected their actions and personal foibles and completely recast them as villains.  And then we won't be happy because we don't have any heroes left.


So this was about China, right??

Yeah, well I'm not happy with Mao just because he was a Genius, which he was, or a gifted Poet, which he was, or a gifted people Leader, which he was, I'm unhappy with him because the Sonofabitch could NOT BE WRONG, which he WAS.  And I have friends whose parents STARVED to death because Mao could not be wrong.  When his trusted Defense Minister Peng DuHuai told him the truth about people starving in the Cultural Revolution era, Mao threw him in jail. I've personally seen part of the 150 page letter Peng wrote to Mao. 

So, yeah, I'll cast him as a worse Villain than if he had been Stupid!
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: fanjanc@gmail.com on Jan 28, 2011, 10:17 pm
Maybe try these, I have no experience with them, nor do I know what shipping will be, just googled for South Africa.

South Africa baby  :D

http://cboards.co.za/

http://www.bosco.co.za/products.asp?gclid=CMjBpPfo3aYCFYKFpAodG1y55w

http://www.trax.co.za/about.php

http://www.cirtech-electronics.com/manufacturing.htm
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: liuzengqiang on Jan 28, 2011, 10:51 pm
What quantity do you need? Maybe a local university with ECE degree could be helpful. They may have prototype machines or routers to do this on small quantity.

Ah, I was warning for distractions. Apologies. I always look at the bright side. China is still more or less one piece and they have some internet there as well :)
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: phibes4000 on Jan 29, 2011, 12:42 am

Maybe try these, I have no experience with them, nor do I know what shipping will be, just googled for South Africa.

South Africa baby  :D

http://cboards.co.za/

http://www.bosco.co.za/products.asp?gclid=CMjBpPfo3aYCFYKFpAodG1y55w

http://www.trax.co.za/about.php

http://www.cirtech-electronics.com/manufacturing.htm

Is this going to become the most political thread on the board? Maybe there are fab houses in Iran and Egypt we could work into the conversation? :)

And let's not get started on African politics/ history/ corruption/ British colonialism...

Only cboards (who look small) have online pricing - works out about same as US or Olimex.  I think I'll just admit defeat and wait for Seeed or Itead to get back.

Re universities, that's an interesting idea, but my PCBs are quite complex (incl surface mount, double layer, vias) and I expect anything here to either be expensive or amateur.
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: retrolefty on Jan 29, 2011, 01:08 am
Quote
Is this going to become the most political thread on the board?


That was my fault, my attempt at a humorious remark got a stone rolling, or is that a rolling stone?

My personal thoughts on China:

I respect their country as a whole just for surviving to be the oldest continuous civilization on earth.
I respect their burden to have to govern the single largest population on earth.
Do I respect their present government? It's certainly better then Mao's rein, and they have made good progress in
improving the life of some of their population. But they certainly have a long was to go before their people can
enjoy the same freedoms we often take for granted.

Lefty
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: intermelt on Jan 29, 2011, 01:11 am
on topic... custompcb.com is in Malaysia.  Just ordered some prototypes from them.  They verified my design with me and even doubled my order!
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: CrossRoads on Jan 29, 2011, 03:51 am
These guys in MA, USA are offering 100 square inches for $95 plus shipping worldwide.
https://www.internationalcircuits.com/layer_grid.php?cat_id=13
Lots of things included - silk screen, solder mask.
Don't know how much effort is needed to create gerber files, drill files, etc.

I don't know if these guys ship international, but I used expresspcb.com's miniboard service to get 14 3.8" x 2.5" boards, fast turnaround, $165.
Same with shipping to AU would be $210, difference is the shipping.
They have a special serivce, 3 of the same size boards, $51 plus shipping ($55 to AU).
The ExpressPCB schematic capture & layout software is quick to learn & easy to use. Here's the design I had built with 2 built up CCAs in a box (cut in half down the middle)
(http://www.crossroadsfencing.com/remote_lights_pcb.jpg)
(http://www.crossroadsfencing.com/scoring_machine_minimal_front.jpg)
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: liuzengqiang on Jan 29, 2011, 05:15 am
CrossRoads,

Thanks for sharing. International is cheaper than the seeedstudio 50mm*50mm * 10 if you're willing to pay for the quantity of board. I have some reservations on ExpressPCB or another one of them. Their software is alright, easy to use but last time I tried they only handle proprietary file formats. Do they export Gerber files now? I use EAGLE. Paid for the light version anyway. If I keep saving money, I may eventually be able to purchase full version in maybe 10 years.  :)
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: CrossRoads on Jan 29, 2011, 05:34 am
That is a drawback with expresspcb, no gerbers.
I couldn't fit most of what I design into the limits of the lowest eagle package tho - 1 schematic sheet, 100mm x 80mm PCB.
Well, maybe they would fit the PCB (10cm x 8cm = 3.9" x 3.1", the size of a Velleman ECS1/2 that I typically build up on), but its $200 jump for that 2nd page of schematic.
Takes a whole page just to show single chip like a MAX7221 connecting to 8 headers to go to 8 7-segment displays.

All depends on one's specific needs.
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: phibes4000 on Jan 29, 2011, 11:19 am

Quote
Is this going to become the most political thread on the board? Maybe there are fab houses in Iran and Egypt we could work into the conversation?

I don't know what that means, (and frankly, I don't care)...

A lame attempt at humour on my part given the direction of the conversation - Egypt is possibly undergoing a revolution, Iran is obviously a 'hot topic'.  Not sure why that got a prickly response. 

For me, the SA ones that looked OK would need me to send designs for a quote, and don't have online pricing.  Maybe I'll send a few my design but I don't get the impression they will be cheap.  As Asia is so close, shipping rates are usually best from there, and curiously from the UK.


on topic... custompcb.com is in Malaysia.  Just ordered some prototypes from them.  They verified my design with me and even doubled my order!
Well, there are a lot of Chinese people in Malaysia and their site says they're closed.

These guys in MA, USA are offering 100 square inches for $95 plus shipping worldwide.
https://www.internationalcircuits.com/layer_grid.php?cat_id=13

This looks like an option - I can produce gerbers no problem.  Thanks!!!
Title: Re: Cheap/Good PCB houses outside China (Chinese New Year)
Post by: intermelt on Jan 29, 2011, 03:50 pm
Quote
Well, there are a lot of Chinese people in Malaysia and their site says they're closed.


My fault for looking at the site on a netbook.  I should have scrolled down a little more.