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Using Arduino => General Electronics => Topic started by: NervusTwitch on Aug 08, 2019, 07:02 am

Title: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 08, 2019, 07:02 am
Ok ive been trying to wire up these timer modules into my car for a chase light/sequential function. The car has 3 lights on each side. I can get them all to light up but trying to set the timer attenuator on the module does nothing.
I have 5 of these modules, only need 2 per side but they all do the same thing so Im not sure if its a user error or possibly something up with the timers.

Also, even though the inner most light, far right in diagram doesnt go through the module, the last 2 lights blink at the same rate as the 1st,again timer set screw doesnt change anything.

Parts Im using:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07MH4GYX1/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

1st pic,The diagram Im following. I have followed just as it shows
2nd, what I have done
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: meltDown on Aug 08, 2019, 07:06 am
Here's OP's pix:

(https://forum.arduino.cc/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=630399.0;attach=319631)

(https://forum.arduino.cc/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=630399.0;attach=319633)

Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: 6v6gt on Aug 08, 2019, 10:05 am
Is this the desired sequence ?

1. Immediately the brake pedal is depressed, the inner led should light. It stays on until the brake pedal is released.
2. After a period of X seconds, the the center led lights. It also then stays on until the brake pedal is released.
3. After a period of Y seconds, the the outer led lights. It then stays on until the brake pedal is released.

If that is the case, I would have expected Vcc of Relay 2 to be fed from CK of relay 1. There may be other problems.

Edit:

I've just read this from https://www.amazon.com.au/HiLetgo-Switch-Adjustable-Module-Second/dp/B01DK8NJNI (https://www.amazon.com.au/HiLetgo-Switch-Adjustable-Module-Second/dp/B01DK8NJNI)

===================
Characteristics: 1. Connected to the power relay to 1-10s fixed cycle pull and disconnect. Specifically: to the relay for 12v power supply, the relay will immediately suck and relay output status: normally open and common conduction, normally closed and disconnected; until the delay 1-10s (can be adjusted), the release of the relay, At this moment, the state of the relay output is: Normally open and common open, normally closed and common conduct; As long as the module is not powered off, this state will keep and release with fixed cycle of 1-10s.
===================

Well it is quite ambiguous. It is not clear if the "delay" (for example 10 seconds) is the delay before the relay is energized, or the period for which the relay remains energised  after being switched on.

Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: TomGeorge on Aug 08, 2019, 11:02 am
Hi,
Welcome to the forum.

Please read the first post in any forum entitled how to use this forum.
http://forum.arduino.cc/index.php/topic,148850.0.html  (http://forum.arduino.cc/index.php/topic,148850.0.html).

That PCB has an LED on it.
Does it light up when you connect power to the input terminals.
Leave the power connected for at least 10seconds to see where the potentiometer is set.

Test just ONE unit.

Remove all the wiring from the output terminals.
Connect 12V to the input terminals only and see what happens.

Do you hear the relay click?

Can you tell us your electronics, hardware experience?

Thanks....Tom... :)
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 08, 2019, 04:57 pm
Ok thanks for the replies.

yes the LED's do light up, I get clicks and I have tried 1 module at a time and they all do the same.

Whats suppose to happen is that when brakes are applied both sides and center lights will sequence 1 time. Parking lights work as normal. Blinkers will sequence starting with the inner light,middle, then outside.

but Im not getting them to sequence. Yesterday I had them all lighting up but the outer 2 bulbs blinked same rate as the inner. I tried turning the attenuator to adjust but nothing happens, they just blink the same speeds.Even trying other modules and 1 at a time, same results.
If it was just 1 or 2 doing this then Id just figure a bad 1, but they all do it so it must be me.

I know this diagram works for my car since it was original made by a couple others for my specific car. Car in question here is 2004 Mustang Mach 1.

This is the guy that originally did it.

https://forums.vintage-mustang.com/vintage-mustang-forum/876090-diy-sequential-led-taillights-under-30-a.html

My electronics experience is mediocre. Nothing great but I get by normally by myself but get stumped with stuff like above.
Ive had no issues using Arduino boards to make things.
EX: Converted several joysticks to USB, completely gutting them and rewiring,various footswitches,led setups.
Ive also made led readouts to show various PC/game related info and somewhat involved button boxes using Arduinos.


Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: TomGeorge on Aug 08, 2019, 06:51 pm
Hi,
Have you adjusted the pots all the way form one end to the other, they are 10 turn pots?
What are you using as your power supply?
Tom.. :)
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 08, 2019, 07:24 pm
Hi,
Have you adjusted the pots all the way form one end to the other, they are 10 turn pots?
What are you using as your power supply?
Tom.. :)
They will turn continuously in either direction. Its just a flat head screw,not the usual plastic phillips type head pots.
The power was the car.

I didnt really have a way to test off the car, besides this looked like a fairly simple diagram compared to some things Ive made before so I didnt really anticipate any issues.

Like I said, all lights almost work as they should. The issue is not being able to change the timings.

What Im finding odd is that instead of the lights sequencing they all will blink at the same speed no matter how much or which direction I turn the pots.
Tail lights stay on as they should,brakes come on and stay as they should.
But blinkers/hazards will all blink at the same rate.

The power LED on the module lights when power is connected. The 2nd led will blink and so will the power led when I activate the blinker. Both LED's flash at same exact rate.
The relays are also clicking on/off at same rate as LED's.

Now for the diagram above I have been chatting with another guy that used the same diagram,parts and car type with proper results. I showed him the same pic as above and he says it should be working. SO we are both kinda stumped why the timing will not change.
I figured both of us are just over looking something, I cant see all 5 being bad out of the box.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 08, 2019, 07:51 pm
If it helps this is the cars wiring diagram.

NOTE:
On the 2 outer lights(circled) they were originally 2 wire sockets, they were changed with FORD 3 wire sockets so as to function same the middle and outer.

(https://i.imgur.com/Rbyg6cu.jpg)
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 08, 2019, 09:31 pm
Oops, in that diagram, the circled lights are backwards, they are the inner lights and vice versa, the labeled inner are actually the outer.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: Slumpert on Aug 08, 2019, 11:13 pm
Did you replace your flasher circuit with an electronic version?

Possible your blinkers are simply blinking too fast for the relay boards work correctly?
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: TomGeorge on Aug 08, 2019, 11:37 pm
Hi,
If you connect the relay input directly to the battery, do you get a delay?
That is the relay clicks sometime after the connection is made?

How long is the first indicator light on for when you have it flashing.
Indicator lights are usually only ON for about 1/2Second and OFF for 1/2Second.

With your circuit, the delay relays are only powered for that 1/2Second, so you cannot get a delay longer than the 1/2Second.

Tom... :)
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 08, 2019, 11:41 pm
Did you replace your flasher circuit with an electronic version?

Possible your blinkers are simply blinking too fast for the relay boards work correctly?
Best of my knowledge its already an electronic version. The repair manual diagram above has an electronic flasher in it.

Also the ones online that have the same car and did this same thing didnt change anything other than cutting out the single 2 wire socket on each side and replacing it with a 3 wire socket just like on the middle and outer lights.

I know Im probably just over looking something here, I just dont have any idea what would keep the pots from affecting the timing.

This is the guy Ive been chatting with trying to figure this out. He did what Im trying to do on basically the same car.

Mustang Sequential lights (https://aminoapps.com/c/maker/page/blog/diy-sequential-tail-light-for-20/8BqT_mun4MDPWlqwGw735kdanQKVGn4tR)
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 08, 2019, 11:54 pm
Hi,
If you connect the relay input directly to the battery, do you get a delay?
That is the relay clicks sometime after the connection is made?

How long is the first indicator light on for when you have it flashing.
Indicator lights are usually only ON for about 1/2Second and OFF for 1/2Second.

With your circuit, the delay relays are only powered for that 1/2Second, so you cannot get a delay longer than the 1/2Second.

Tom... :)
I havent tried to the battery yet.
I believe it is a very short delay, not even a second.

When the lights do flash, they are your typical turn signal speed.

As for the circuit, Im following the diagram above and the link in my last post is the same exact thing. He used that same diagram to do what Im trying.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: TomGeorge on Aug 09, 2019, 12:02 am
Hi,
Looking at the link, its a massive show and NO tell.
There is no setup instructions that I can see.

You will have to set the delay times up on a battery, so you can see if you are adjusting it correctly.
Connect to the battery and do not disconnect until relay has activated.

Tom... :)
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 09, 2019, 12:31 am
Hi,
Looking at the link, its a massive show and NO tell.
There is no setup instructions that I can see.

You will have to set the delay times up on a battery, so you can see if you are adjusting it correctly.
Connect to the battery and do not disconnect until relay has activated.

Tom... :)
Yeah, its not a great how to on anything but I chatted with him and he gave me the diagram he used and its the one from my OP.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 09, 2019, 01:53 am
Here's what I tried.

Instead of using the car battery I have an old bench test power supply that simulates running 12v car electronics in the house.

Only connecting the VCC and GND wires to power the "Power" led lights immediately but the other module LED never lights nor any clicks.
To be honest Im not really sure what I should expect. I tried to figure out how to trip the relay but relays are bit of weak spot for me.

What would be the simplest way to trip the relay for testing, not worried about testing with the blink function since I know I would need an electronic flasher? I assume just powering the module should eventually trip the relay.

BTW forgot to mention that the diagram shows LED's for lights but these are just your standard 3157 bulbs.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: 6v6gt on Aug 09, 2019, 02:51 am
When you apply power to the relay module via Vcc and Ground, a timer starts. As soon as the timer expires (after 1 to 10 seconds depending on the setting of the potentiometer) the relay should be energized and the blue led should switch on. The relay will stay energized until power is removed.

You have understood that the potentiometer is multi turn precision type. It may require 20 turns to travel from its minimum to its maximum value. Once it reaches an extremity, you can still turn the screw but it simply doesn't do anything. You may hear a very slight click on every rotation once it has reached the extremity, however.

Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 09, 2019, 03:37 am
When you apply power to the relay module via Vcc and Ground, a timer starts. As soon as the timer expires (after 1 to 10 seconds depending on the setting of the potentiometer) the relay should be energized and the blue led should switch on. The relay will stay energized until power is removed.

You have understood that the potentiometer is multi turn precision type. It may require 20 turns to travel from its minimum to its maximum value. Once it reaches an extremity, you can still turn the screw but it simply doesn't do anything. You may here a very slight click on every rotation once it has reached the extremity, however.


Thanks.
Yeah the blue led never lit nor any clicks.
Im thinking they are bad.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 09, 2019, 04:58 am
Update.

Finally got 1 module to actually adjust. Takes several turns just to make any noticeable changes.
Also to trigger the relay it needs more than 12v.

The 12v power supply I used wouldnt do it.

Straight to the car battery sitting around 12v after car not running all day made such a small click that if your finger wasnt on it you wouldnt know.

Start the car and relay has a good loud click,although another I tried had nothing ever trigger.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 09, 2019, 05:23 am
Can you post a schematic of your circuit before you added the relay modules that shows their normal wiring ?

Quote
Im thinking they are bad.  
Quote
but they all do the same thing so Im not sure if its a user error or possibly something up with the timers.
I'm thinking it's the wiring. I think there is something not right. First of all the chance of getting a bad relay module is super slim to begin with . The chance of getting multiple bad modules is like nil.
I don't like your schematic. Can you draw it differently so it is easier to see the wiring.

If I were you I would simply assume I made a big mistake and start over by putting everything back to the way it was and then add just one module. Have you taken any voltage measurements with a DMM ?
If you can remove the relay modules from the schematic and show how it was before you added them that would help.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 09, 2019, 06:22 am
Can you post a schematic of your circuit before you added the relay modules that shows their normal wiring ?
 


I'm thinking it's the wiring. I think there is something not right. First of all the chance of getting a bad relay module is super slim to begin with . The chance of getting multiple bad modules is like nil.
I don't like your schematic. Can you draw it differently so it is easier to see the wiring.

If I were you I would simply assume I made a big mistake and start over by putting everything back to the way it was and then add just one module. Have you taken any voltage measurements with a DMM ?
If you can remove the relay modules from the schematic and show how it was before you added them that would help.
The diagram I know isnt easy to read, I personally didnt draw it. I assume the relay diagram is what you are referring to as not liking.
As for the way the car was before adding anything, the schem is in post #7. Sorry if I didnt link the pic correctly, not a big forum user. But right clicking and open in new tab shows it much bigger.

I have put everything back to original then trying to add 1 module. I got the light without a module to work as normal for the car, then the light with the 1 module connected would only flash at same speed as the one without. The timing set screw would do nothing.


Ok original car circuit before anything added. Note the lights circled were 2 wire sockets replaced with Ford 3 wire sockets with colors corresponding to the other listed in this diagram:

(https://i.imgur.com/Rbyg6cu.jpg)

The diagram for modules: The colors I used correspond with the car schematic above with exception of the red. The green wire on car was cut and module placed in between.

(https://i.imgur.com/iCvAlvu.jpg)

Hopefully this is easier to read and Im here because I do assume a mistake somewhere's, I just cant see it. Im following the color diagram exactly. Somewhat lost here.??
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 09, 2019, 06:33 am
Let's try a different approach.
Foeget the car.
Pretend it doesn't exist.
Pretend you bought the module to delay a led string or whatever.
Wire it up as if you only doing that and see if it works. Make dure you use the Normally non- conductive contact and use a different circuit for the light you are switching that is NOT connected to the relay Vcc or GND. Two separate circuits. Two separate power sources.

If that works, then you can begin to isolate the issue by changing the wiring to one single supply.
If that works then you can move to step two and add the second module.
Finally , you should be able to simulate the car wiring before actually installing it in the car.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 09, 2019, 07:32 pm
Here's what i got so far.

I went through all 5 one at a time. Only connected VCC and GND to the car battery.

3 would trigger the relay immediately. No matter how much I turned the pot no changes at all in delay. Counter clockwise is suppose to increase dealy. I turned for a full 2 minutes just to be sure in clockwise,never a change.

4th on would never trigger with same technique above.

Then the 5th of which I never hooked up or tried, still in package worked just as it was suppose to.

To me this sounds like I messed up in the beginning by mistakenly shorting something and toasted the 4 I kept trying. Only thing I can think of.

I mean at this point they are so cheap I may just order so more. Im sure they werent bad but I have my moments where I dont realize something I did then poof....lol.

As for raschemmel comment, sorry Im not quiet sure what you mean, I am by no means great at this stuff but I usually learn as I go for what Im needing to do over the years and these modules are new to me. Ive dealt with relays in cars, car alarms and such but not like these.
 
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 09, 2019, 07:52 pm
Quote
As for raschemmel comment, sorry Im not quiet sure what you mean, I am by no means great at this stuff but I usually learn as I go for what Im needing to do over the years and these modules are new to me. Ive dealt with relays in cars, car alarms and such but not like these.
I don't know which comment you are referring to so I am going to assume you mean the following:

Quote
I'm thinking it's the wiring. I think there is something not right. First of all the chance of getting a bad relay module is super slim to begin with . The chance of getting multiple bad modules is like nil.
I don't like your schematic. Can you draw it differently so it is easier to see the wiring.

If I were you I would simply assume I made a big mistake and start over by putting everything back to the way it was and then add just one module. Have you taken any voltage measurements with a DMM ?
If you can remove the relay modules from the schematic and show how it was before you added them that would help.
A word of advice , from a professional technician:
I have done thousands of projects in the past 38 years and they almost alway follow the same pattern:
1. Engineer designs something.
2. Engineer tells me to build prototype.
3. Engineer gives me shipping reciept of some number to pick up parts from shipping/receiving.
4. I pick up parts.
5. I unpack and organize parts.
6. I test all parts.
7. Everything that works correctly gets received for the project.
8. Anything that doesn't work gets set aside for engineer to inspect before contacting vendor.
9. I build prototype.
10. I test prototype.



In view of the above, do you think it would be possible to build the prototype with bad parts ?
Remember what deep throat said : "Trust No-one !"

Well you buy something , don't build anything with it until you've done your due diligence as
Shipping Receiving.


Out of curiosity, what was the battery voltage when you tested the 4 units ?
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 09, 2019, 08:13 pm
Good advice.

Normally I would check something like that but I didnt.
Honestly I think I messed them up not paying attention, wouldnt be the first time. Also I remember now in the beginning blowing the blinker fuse and remember that is when my issues started. That fuse slipped my mind. Age I guess is catching up to me..lol.

The car battery was between 12.5v-13v, hooked up a slow charger on it so to make sure I had enough volts with the car off.

I knew my problems were most likely user error but couldnt put my finger on where.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 09, 2019, 08:18 pm
Pop quiz:

BEFORE you connected the FIRST module, did you or did you not measure the voltage on the wires you were about to connect to it ?


Quote
That fuse slipped my mind. Age I guess is catching up to me..lol.  
How old are you ?
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 09, 2019, 09:40 pm
Yes I measured the volts at the cars harness where I connected. Dont remember the exact volts since that was last weekend but it was around 12v.

As for my age, Im not old but I have conditions that affect my memory and cause me not to always think properly, kind of like a foggy brain. And that 1st day I messed with all this I had that foggy feeling.

I have severe nerve damage and what Dr's call me is a very bad brittle diabetic.
I take 5-10 shots daily of 2 different insulins, sometimes more.

Due to that and over 20yrs of being a diabetic when having insulin reactions the Dr tells me those have the same affect as using illegal drugs,causing to kill off brain cells causing memory issues.

Add that with the severe nerve damage throughout my entire body is also causing memory issues.
Long term memory is good but over the last 5 or so years learning or remembering new things is an issue.

Ex would be my guitar. Been playing since I was 13 and can play all that stuff I learned from then but after learning new things now I forget them very soon,talking like within a month. Can still play Bass, but no longer remember how to play drums and my muscle memory functions are whacked too.

As for my age,I'll be 44 in less than a month, I know not old but my body disagrees and also considered %100 disabled.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 09, 2019, 09:48 pm
Sorry to hear about the diabetes .
I'm 70 and still working full time as a technician. My job requires a lot of memory work. When I worked at Apple I was responsible for knowing the exact location all the parts at any time of the day. I created a spec
called TTF ('Time To Find') and my target spec was 1 minute. I was within spec at least half the time.
While my memory for inventory related things is excellent , I have trouble remembering events, like what I did yesterday. Every day seems like yesterday so I can't remember if I did something yesterday or last week. I told my boss, "Ask me where anything is, but don't ask me what I did yesterday."
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 09, 2019, 10:40 pm
Yep, that not remebering what I did even 10 mins ago is an issue for me. I know exactly what your talking about.

There are times Im talking to my wife and right in the middle of the sentence I just forget what Im even saying and sometimes I have to ask her what I was even talking about.

She used to give me a hard time about it but she's catching up to my age now and is realizing how I am. She's 9 years under me and not giving me so much a hard time anymore....lol.

Im wishing I could go back to work full time but not going to happen. I still work what I can and what disability allows but I went from working many hours weekly to almost nothing.

I even started working at my dad's company when I was 12 on telecommunications systems.I would run cables,wire jacks and other similar things for him on weekends and after school. We would run cables and such for systems up to 500 lines in large office buildings.

He paid me just as he would hired help. At times I made upto $400 a week at 12yrs old in the 80's. That was alot for a kid back then.

Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 09, 2019, 10:45 pm
Yeah, don't get me started on the wife thing. As an electronics engineering tech I am a packrat and she never stops asking me to throw stuff out and I almost never comply. When I no longer need something
I give it away.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 09, 2019, 10:49 pm
Yeah, don't get me started on the wife thing. As an electronics engineering tech I am a packrat and she never stops asking me to throw stuff out and I almost never comply. When I no longer need something
I give it away.
LOL.
My wife hates that Im a packrat. If it looks like I could use it I keep it. I'll take broken things apart and take parts out I might be able to use later.

While back I took out a couple joysticks I had from late 90's and converted them to USB and total rewire with added functions, she just rolls her eyes.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 09, 2019, 10:56 pm
Quote
While back I took out a couple joysticks I had from late 90's and converted them to USB and total rewire with added functions, she just rolls her eyes.
I don't try to explain anything I'm doing. Awhile back I had two tables set up in the garage with about 40 different arduino circuits breadboarded. When she asked me what I was doing I just said I was 'upgrading my jobskills to keep up to date with the latest technology" She never asked me again and I'm doing a much smaller version of the same thing right now with ESP8266 WIFI enable microcontrollers. I have about 8 of them breadboarded, along with a couple of ATMega328s . I'm studying IOT on Udemy.com (along with Matlab and Python). I hope to get around to Solidworks eventually but so far haven't had time.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 09, 2019, 11:12 pm
After making this display she stopped asking me what Im doing.
Made this with various odd and ends I robbed from broken stuff then used Arduino 324 micro.
That frame its in is actually an old picture frame with a piece of plexiglass cut and mounted to front.
Then used black vinyl wrap to frame the displays and LED's.

There is a button on it to where I can change the programmed info to many different readouts.

Racing Sim Display (https://youtu.be/C1fWaSTXDCM)
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 09, 2019, 11:53 pm
Awesome display dude !

You should sell those .
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 10, 2019, 12:56 am
Awesome display dude !

You should sell those .
Thanks.

Guess I could since I didnt find much anything like this for sale online anywhere, tons of button boxes out there though.
But the minute I started advertising this in the Race sim community I think I would bombed and overloaded with everyone wanting them...lol.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 13, 2019, 05:12 am
Ok I have no idea if Im just bad with these things or just bad luck with them alltogether.

Ordered another set of 5.

Tested with only VCC and GND connected to car battery.Car off and battery voltage was 13.9v
2 worked for maybe 2 cycles, then afterwards just made a buzzing sound. I removed power from battery then reconnected, now they do nothing but light up the power light.

Tested a 3rd and it never clicked, only power led.

Tested the one that worked from the 1st batch I bought, still functions properly.

I have not tested the last 2.Do those tomorrow since its getting late now.
Thinking these things might be just junk.

Any ideas now?
Maybe a better alternative to these that function the same way? Adjustable timer,12v DC for car and not overly complicated.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 13, 2019, 05:46 am
If I had to take a wild ass guess it would be that when they say 12V, they mean 12V and NOT 13.8V and
they cannot tolerate anything above 12V.
The correct way to verify that is to test them all repeated using a powersupply or alkaline battery pack that
does NOT exceed 12V. If you don't have a power supply then get 8 1.5V batteries and put them in a battery pack and then add a silicon diode to bleed off the voltage above 12V so the total voltage is 12V and not above. Then test all of them at least three times at 12V. Once you have done your due diligence as the
shipping/receiving guy then give them to the tech (also you) and let him blow them up one by one on a car battery.  :smiley-grin:
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 13, 2019, 06:33 am
I was thinking of trying something like that with batteries since my 12v DC converter died on me.

What measurement diode would you suggest, I have a bunch on them here just not sure what I should use.

Whats confusing me on these is its what the other car guys are doing to do the same exact thing using same modules Im using.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 13, 2019, 07:07 am
Quote
What measurement diode would you suggest,
A 1N4001 to 1N4007 is fine. It is only to provide a 0.7V diode drop because brand new alkaline batteries
are NEVER 1.5V. They are always somewhere between 1.55 and 1.6V.
This means eight 1.5V batteries will total 12.4 to 12.8V. If the purpose of the test is to see if the modules
are not damaged by 12V or less , we have to make sure not to exceed 12V. By connecting the unbanded
Anode end of a diode to the +12V terminal and connecting the banded end to the module , it should drop 0.7V and you can test the module with 11.5 to 11.9V.


Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 13, 2019, 07:11 am
Thanks.
Good, I have probably 400-500 of those 1N4001,lol.

I'll give that a try next on the others I havent tried yet.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 13, 2019, 07:15 am
Quote
have probably 400-500 of those 1N4001,lol. 
Matlab says you can drop 350 V with 500 1N4001 diodes. (FYI).
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 13, 2019, 07:42 pm
I looked at the order page and saw this:

"Output is voltage free & can be connected up to 10A load.Input voltage:DC12V.Stream with relay protection"

Im not blowing these by connecting them straight to the battery am I?

Out of a total of 10, only 1 continues to work, none of the others will ever trigger the relays.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 13, 2019, 08:09 pm
Quote
Im not blowing these by connecting them straight to the battery am I?

Out of a total of 10, only 1 continues to work, none of the others will ever trigger the relays.
The LM555 TIMER IC (http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/lm555.pdf) can tolerate supply voltages up to 18V so there's plenty of margin between that and 13.8V so quite honestly, I have no idea what is going wrong but experience tells me that if someone blows up 9 out of 10 devices , thinking they are wiring  them correctly , there's a pretty good chance they're mistaken.

So, here's the $64,000 question.
We know from your wiring diagram that SOME Of the modules were connected according to your posted schematic. But out of the 9 that went bad, were there ANY that you ONLY connected the power terminals
directly to the battery and nothing else ? (and used an ohm meter to check the relay contact position)

Is there any static where you are ? (pops and shocks when you touch something ?)

Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 13, 2019, 08:32 pm
The 5 new ones I got I only connected the VCC and GND terminals straight to car battery, nothing else just as was suggested in a previous reply.

Since the car sat overnight, the battery was at 12.7v.
With doing just as above the one that works still works doing just that.
3-4 of them would buzz like a bunch of mad bees for 1 or 2 cycles then they never trigger the relay. some just never triggered.

Ive never had an issue blowing components like this so its really confusing me.

Static electricity isnt a problem here, never happens except when its cold outside and even then its rare.
But i also have the habit before touching electronics like this to touch some bare metal or something grounded before handling electronics.

Im careful not to touch any of the modules to any metal,no accidental wire touches.Ive been trying to be as careful as possible to rule that stuff out.

I found a couple vids and they are doing exactly what I am trying with no issue, only difference is the type of car.

He has it working (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0c8jCZzVvGU&t=696s)

Also working, but rambles a bit (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l638rmEn26Y)
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 13, 2019, 08:59 pm
I don't know what to tell you.
Bad batch ?
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 13, 2019, 09:16 pm
That would be my luck. If it werent for bad luck I wouldnt have any.
There is a reason I dont play the lottery...lol.

Guess only option is to try another vender.

I mean this is a fairly simple circuit.
I figure if I can wire up that display I showed and rewire an old joystick that had something around 100 wires and connections is it, I could handle 3 wires to a module, apparently not...lol.

I made this not long ago and its a mess of wires,buttons,pots,LED lighting and encoders. Labeling is printed on laserjet with polycarbonate cover to protect them and can be removed to change the label cards I made in photoshop.

(https://i.imgur.com/oTf6qFy.jpg)
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 13, 2019, 09:24 pm
Also forgot.

Thank you very much for all the help.

Now I will just decide what I want to do about this. If I do "ever" get it working I'll reply back.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 13, 2019, 09:49 pm
Really Cool.


I made this back in '82 for the Los Angeles Museum of Fine Arts Contempory Art Council's Awards Banquet 'Tribute 82', in Paramount Studio's Sound Stage 13 (the one they filmed the first Star Trek movie in) .
Leonard Nimoy and William Shatner were guest speaker. The controller consists of about 35 LM555 Timer IC circuits that control the UFO landing and taking off special effect. The light rings are aluminum tubes welded together by the Lighting Designer Sam Salde (my boss).They range in size from 3 feet in diameter
way up in the distant corner to 30 feet in diameter (closest to camera). Each ring has 16 segments of neon
wired in opposing pairs to create 4 channels. The segments are numbered CW 1,2 3,4 1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4, with all like number outputs controlled by the same signal. So there are four control signals, ch-1 , ch-2, ch-3, ch4. The channels are sequenced sequentially CW for landing , CCW for taking off. Since like channels oppose each other on the ring it creates the POV illusion of rotation. If you set the speed pot for the :

ring-1:  small ring to             VERY VERY FAST and the
ring-2:  next largest ring to   VERY FAST , and the
ring-3:  next largest to           FAST and the
ring-4:  next largest to             MEDIUM
ring-5:  next largest to            MEDIUM SLOW
ring-6:  largest ring to              SLOW

the resulting special effect in a dark soundstage is that of a flying saucer landing.
The "Grand Entrance" was Leonard Nimoy and William Shatner leading all the guests down the ramp
to the tune of Star Wars with the flying saucer special effect running at full speed.

The photo , however was taken after the guests had eaten dinner and were dancing to live orchestra waltz
music so  the rings are NOT being sequenced, and ALL rings are rotating at a graceful slow pace chosen to match the waltz music as close as possible.

It took 3 months to design the circuit and 3 days to a week to wire it up.
It worked perfectly on the first test at exactly 11:45am for the Fire Marshal inspection test. (which, BTW,
is a PASS/FAIL test. If the equipment does not work as advertised, the vendor is ordered to remove it from the premises without delay and no second chances are given for the test. That's Hollywood for you)

The controller can be set to reverse the flight direction and spin direction. This creates the effect of the saucer increasing spin speed as it takes off toward the distant smallest ring.


(https://forum.arduino.cc/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=630399.0;attach=320318)

(https://forum.arduino.cc/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=630399.0;attach=320320)

BTW-The water fountain in the lower left corner was also my controller. It controlled 48 water pumps to
create a dancing water fountain effect .
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 13, 2019, 10:13 pm
Wow, thats awesome.

Way above any of my skills.

Got your PM and done.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 13, 2019, 10:18 pm
You'd be surprised.
Just imagine getting a book on Timer ICs (http://chiclassiccomp.org/docs/content/books/Electronics/ICTimerCookbook1stEd1977_WalterGJung.pdf) and
spending 3-months building circuits and wiring them to the leds , pots and switches. In the end, it all comes down to wiring 10,000 points, one point at a time.
This is the book. (William Shatner autographed it at the event)
(https://forum.arduino.cc/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=630399.0;attach=320324)

FYI- The link above is to the 13 Mb PDF free download of this book. (take it !)
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: NervusTwitch on Aug 13, 2019, 10:53 pm
Ive never really met anyone all that famous.

Thanks on the pdf link, I downloaded it...it might interest me since I like to tinker with all sorts of things.
Title: Re: NE555 Timer Delay Module
Post by: raschemmel on Aug 13, 2019, 10:57 pm
Quote
.it might interest me since I like to tinker with all sorts of things.  
Look up Monostable Vibrator (that's your LM555 TIMER delay circuit.
(https://forum.arduino.cc/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=630399.0;attach=320355)