Closed (ouch) or Open Hardware new Uno's ?

[mowcius]

Maybe they have outsourced assembly to some new 3rd party and they haven't yet got all their groove on yet.

Well they obviously haven't got the same team working on it who made the duemilanove boards.

I have seen china fakes of boards which have been considered bad but have still looked better than these.

Mowcius

[MicrocontrollerGuy]

Oh, for the good old universally available RS232 and LPT ports...why did computer makers ever quit making them

Because they were universally available and anyone could use them. There's no money in that, and you risk letting competitors into the field if anyone can easily interface with a computer. By charging $2,000 for a VID and only issuing them to bona-fide companies, the computer vendors can keep the little guy out of the picture and make some extra cash on the side.

[macegr]

dcuartielles manifesto

Oh I completely understand the effort required to get something like this done...the long discussions, arguments, realization of approaching deadlines, failures, successes, days when you want to just give up, 36 hours nonstop work, etc.

The only concern most of us have is that the VID/PID thing has added something very proprietary to the mix. Obviously it's hard to get more proprietary than microcontrollers and other chips, but this is a proprietary element that didn't necessarily have to be added.

I realize that the USB-IF has created the majority of this inconvenience but I wish there was another way.

[thegeekway]

and we still give our reference design FOR FREE, we include all of our software FOR FREE, we give you access  to the source FOR FREE, we get professionals to craft the code inside the USB chip and give you the firm FOR FREE, the only thing I could do now is giving you the keys to my bike (I don't own a car) and the password to my laptop ...

...about those keys...

[admin]

Mowcius:

It's the same time as always and it was made in italy as always.we don't manufacture in china. full stop.
If you make a lot of boards a very small number can, by mistake, end up being sold when they shouldn't have.

the full response is here http://arduino.cc/blog/2010/10/01/one-bad-arduino-doesnt-spoil-the-barrel/

BTW it is much better to contact us directly with your questions instead of spending days speculating without any information.

[admin]

about the VID and PID issue..

We are required to purchase a VID from the USB IF in order to sell usb devices. The contract that we signed with the USB IF specifically FORBIDS us from giving away PIDs
for your reading pleasure :
""The company set forth above hereby applies for a USB Vendor ID
Number and agrees to the following: The USB Implementers Forum is the
authority which assigns and maintains all USB Vendor ID Numbers. Each
Vendor ID Number is assigned to one company for its sole and exclusive
use, along with associated Product ID Numbers. They may not be sold,
transferred, or used by others, directly or indirectly, except in
special circumstances and then only upon prior written approval by
USB-IF. Unauthorized use of assigned or unassigned USB Vendor ID
Numbers and associated Product ID Numbers are strictly prohibited."

Having said this i'm negotiating to them so that we can release a PID to whoever wants to build a board for non-commercial purposes. (if they want to sell they have to buy a VID or use a chip from a vendor that releases a PID )

We have been incredibly open as usual and released everything the day after we announced the products. Anybody can build an exact replica of the Arduino UNO with no restrictions.

[macegr]

That's the response I was looking for, thanks Massimo.

[mowcius]

Having said this i'm negotiating to them so that we can release a PID to whoever wants to build a board for non-commercial purposes. (if they want to sell they have to buy a VID or use a chip from a vendor that releases a PID )

That is good news.

It's the same time as always and it was made in italy as always.we don't manufacture in china. full stop.
If you make a lot of boards a very small number can, by mistake, end up being sold when they shouldn't have.

I'm glad to hear it but in that case, from previous experience, I would not have expected anything short of perfect quality in the arduino boards. They have always been great before.

BTW it is much better to contact us directly with your questions instead of spending days speculating without any information.

It is always interesting to dicuss people's views on a particular subject. I understand a message was sent to you. We then discussed things as normal people do. I'm sorry if this kind of stained the forum or got a bit out of hand but discussions are discussions and whether the views expressed are due to a minority of products or not, it doesn't matter, it was interesting to hear people's opinions.

It is very good to hear that is has all been resolved, refunds and replacements are being offered and hopefully the only remarks I will hear about these boards in the future are positive ones! Heck I might

Mowcius

[scienceguy8]

Just a quick summation and my two cents.

http://www.gilberti-industries.com/2010/10/02/arduino-uno-and-its-usb/

[mowcius]

quick summation

also VID not VIN

[scienceguy8]

VID not VIN

Thanks.  Only happened twice, but fixed.

[Grumpy_Mike]

Is this the last word on it:-
http://xkcd.com/258/

[iloromero]

I do not think this is an issue. It is no different than using in your projects the FT232RL FTDI chip with their VID and PID. We can use Atmel's VIP and PID.

For those of us who want to do a few dozen clones and sell them on ebay there is hope! Am I missing something?  

This is what Atmel has to say (you may google it):

Question
Can I use the VID and PID provided by Atmel ?
Answer
Customer may keep the Atmel Vendor Identifier (Atmel VID) and Product Identifier (PID) in their product that integrates an Atmel USB Flash Microcontroller ("Integrated Product") from one Atmel original example subject to the following acknowledgments and/or conditions:
- Customer must execute Atmel's Limited License Agreement (Atmel USB Flash Microcontroller Software Suite) and comply with all terms and conditions.
- Customer cannot apply to USB compliance testing with the USB-IF, therefore Customer cannot use the USB logo for an Integrated Product using the Atmel VID.
- All software is provided AS IS and Customer is responsible to insure the USB compliance of the Integrated Product.
- Customer must integrate the Atmel USB Flash Microcontroller Software and the USB descriptors with no changes apart from:
1-The manufacturer string, which must include the Customer's URL address and finish with "powered by Atmel®": e.g. "www.customer.com powered by Atmel®".
2-The maximum power fields, which must be compatible with the actual power consumption of the Integrated Product for each possible USB configuration.
3- When applicable the Endpoint polling Interval fields can be adapted to the application.
-Customer must insure compatibility with all the features of the Atmel original example if a custom host driver is distributed with the Integrated Product.