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Topic: What's this new Arduino website - arduino.org ? (Read 15286 times) previous topic - next topic

Robin2

There appears to be a new Arduino website http://arduino.org/   - what's all that about?

My first impression (when the page opens) is that it is even more useless than arduino.cc

If there is some sort of split or power struggle in the Arduino camp I wonder which faction will be best for this Forum?

I have no idea who may be on which side of the struggle and I don't care. I have not come across anyone who has done enough for this forum to merit support.

...R
Two or three hours spent thinking and reading documentation solves most programming problems.

pYro_65

I guess they want to change their domain. Although that site looks like it'll be the commercial side of things, while this .cc domain will host the support stuff.


nickgammon

Well, Arduino Uno (clones I presume) are available on eBay for around $US 5.

They seem to be selling them at the Arduino store for €20.00 (around $US 22) and for $US 24.95 from Adafruit.

According to Wikipedia Arduino had sold 700,000 "official boards" by 2013, compared to 300,000 in 2011. So, around 150,000 boards a year.

Let's assume that the raw board can be made for $1.50 since the eBay sellers would have to make some profit. Maybe, $2.50.

Let's further assume that the wholesale price is 50% of the retail, which means they sell them to Adafruit etc. for around $12. So that's around $10 profit per board. Multiply by 150,000 boards, and you get $1.5 million profit per year.

That's pure guesswork on my part, but it is probably roughly in the ballpark. Now $1.5 million is serious money, and conceivably as the clone-makers muscle their way in, there might be differences of opinion about how to claw some of the profit back.

Please post technical questions on the forum, not by personal message. Thanks!

More info: http://www.gammon.com.au/electronics

Riva

I guess they want to change their domain. Although that site looks like it'll be the commercial side of things, while this .cc domain will host the support stuff.
They have no interest in the forum side of things as they see it as a sink-hole for money/labour/skill maintaining it so they are setting up another website to run away and leave us.  :(
Don't PM me for help as I will ignore it.

nickgammon

I think you need to be clear in your mind who "they" are.
Please post technical questions on the forum, not by personal message. Thanks!

More info: http://www.gammon.com.au/electronics

nickgammon

Besides which, we, the contributors to the forum, are unpaid.
Please post technical questions on the forum, not by personal message. Thanks!

More info: http://www.gammon.com.au/electronics

Robin2

That's pure guesswork on my part, but it is probably roughly in the ballpark. Now $1.5 million is serious money, and conceivably as the clone-makers muscle their way in, there might be differences of opinion about how to claw some of the profit back.
Seems a reasonable estimate.

When you place that number alongside the very poor support that this Forum has been getting it is a bit difficult to justify recommending newcomers to buy "real" Arduinos to support the system.

All of my 4 Arduinos are official ones - am I the fool?

...R
Two or three hours spent thinking and reading documentation solves most programming problems.

Riva

I think you need to be clear in your mind who "they" are.
'They' are the Arduino team on the payroll.
Don't PM me for help as I will ignore it.

Riva

Besides which, we, the contributors to the forum, are unpaid.
Yes I realize that and hope I also contribute in some small way. What about the Admins though, are there services also free?
Don't PM me for help as I will ignore it.

GoForSmoke

Seems a reasonable estimate.

When you place that number alongside the very poor support that this Forum has been getting it is a bit difficult to justify recommending newcomers to buy "real" Arduinos to support the system.

All of my 4 Arduinos are official ones - am I the fool?

...R

Just an ardent supporter. The value of the voluntary free time you put in dwarfs the cost of the boards, I'm sure.

You could make your own and that is encouraged by Arduino. What we say here is please buy at least one.
1) http://gammon.com.au/blink  <-- tasking Arduino 1-2-3
2) http://gammon.com.au/serial <-- techniques howto
3) http://gammon.com.au/interrupts
Your sketch can sense ongoing process events in time.
Your sketch can make events to control it over time.

jurs

There appears to be a new Arduino website http://arduino.org/   - what's all that about?
Arduino has five founders, which are Massimo Banzi, David Cuartielles, David Mellis, Tom Igoe und Gianluca Martino.

Arduino consists of two different companies:
Arduino LLC ==> company in the USA, which posesses the trademark "Arduino"
Arduino S.R.L. ==> company in Italy, which produces the "original" Arduino boards ("made in Italy")

"Arduino S.R.L." was formerly known as the company "Smart Projects S.R.L."
This company is owned completely by Gianluca Martino. But unfortunately this one of the founders is now quarrelling with the other four founders about the future of "Arduino".

I think the central point in the quarrel is, where the Arduino boards shall be manufactured in the future: The four founders of Arduino LLC in the USA want the "original Arduino" boards to be produced all over the world where the Arduino users are sitting. So perhaps they want cheap boards to be manufactured also in countries like India, Brazil or China. Not only als "clone" and "fake" boards, but as official "original Arduino" boards.

And the owner of Arduino S.R.L. is strictly against that, and he wants his own company in Italy to be the only manufacturer of "original Arduino" boards in the world.

The new website arduino.org belongs to Arduino S.R.L.

A legal battle is currently fought between Arduino S.R.L. and Arduino LLC at the Massachusetts District Court. But that's another thing and is not about manufacturing the "original Arduino" boards, but in that case the fight is about the trademark "Arduino". The owners of Arduino LLC are not very amused about
- the company renaming of ""Smart Projects S.R.L." to ""Arduino S.R.L." in Italy
- and about the new website Arduino.org used by that company

I don't know who may profit from the current lawsuit and those will follow.
But surely the lawyers will make a lot of profit from both companies.

Vaclav

Arduino has five founders, which are Massimo Banzi, David Cuartielles, David Mellis, Tom Igoe und Gianluca Martino.

Arduino consists of two different companies:
Arduino LLC ==> company in the USA, which posesses the trademark "Arduino"
Arduino S.R.L. ==> company in Italy, which produces the "original" Arduino boards ("made in Italy")

"Arduino S.R.L." was formerly known as the company "Smart Projects S.R.L."
This company is owned completely by Gianluca Martino. But unfortunately this one of the founders is now quarrelling with the other four founders about the future of "Arduino".

I think the central point in the quarrel is, where the Arduino boards shall be manufactured in the future: The four founders of Arduino LLC in the USA want the "original Arduino" boards to be produced all over the world where the Arduino users are sitting. So perhaps they want cheap boards to be manufactured also in countries like India, Brazil or China. Not only als "clone" and "fake" boards, but as official "original Arduino" boards.

And the owner of Arduino S.R.L. is strictly against that, and he wants his own company in Italy to be the only manufacturer of "original Arduino" boards in the world.

The new website arduino.org belongs to Arduino S.R.L.

A legal battle is currently fought between Arduino S.R.L. and Arduino LLC at the Massachusetts District Court. But that's another thing and is not about manufacturing the "original Arduino" boards, but in that case the fight is about the trademark "Arduino". The owners of Arduino LLC are not very amused about
- the company renaming of ""Smart Projects S.R.L." to ""Arduino S.R.L." in Italy
- and about the new website Arduino.org used by that company

I don't know who may profit from the current lawsuit and those will follow.
But surely the lawyers will make a lot of profit from both companies.

I am with Robin2, and as inspector Gerard put it "I don't care".

So "they" - either faction- want to make $ selling hardware and have free contributions on forums like this one to fix the crappy software being developed for free also, right?

Pretty smart business model as long as majority of users want to blink LED.

And as one of the administrator here put it when this site went  "new format" - what do you want for free?



Robin2

@jurs, Thanks for that insight.

I find myself in a strange situation vis-a-vis manufacture in Italy and elsewhere.

I rather liked the idea that the boards were made in Italy - or at least within the EU.

I don't like the idea of shifting production (of anything) to a cheap country like China or India so that we in the West can have the goods cheaper. At the same time I have no objection to China and India manufacturing things and exporting them.

In my mind the answer could be that the official Arduino boards can be manufactured anywhere but there should be a standard international export price so that (say) boards are exported from Italy at the same price (expressed in Euros) as boards are exported from India or China. That means the "profit" of cheaper labour etc stays in the country it belongs to and jobs in Italy (or USA or wherever) are not exported to countries with cheap labour and poorer working conditions.

...R
Two or three hours spent thinking and reading documentation solves most programming problems.

GoForSmoke

It's Open Source. The crime is when non-official is marked and sold as official.

Where official boards are made should matter to people who want to support Arduino and feed money back into the organization including the people who make the boards. Their pay is part of the price. To make boards at prices that compete with China out of parts that cost far more would skin those workers and shut the official makers down.

We can take some of the wind out of this by not buying knockoffs with Arduino in the name.

1) http://gammon.com.au/blink  <-- tasking Arduino 1-2-3
2) http://gammon.com.au/serial <-- techniques howto
3) http://gammon.com.au/interrupts
Your sketch can sense ongoing process events in time.
Your sketch can make events to control it over time.

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