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Topic: Domino.IO project is on Kickstarter now (Read 8376 times) previous topic - next topic

Squonk42

I directly copy promotion email they send me.

drop a line at website?  (Michel Stempin is one of founder and he is active member here)

http://forum.arduino.cc/index.php?action=profile;u=141157


Hi there, Michel Stempin (aka Squonk) here!

Thank you for your support!

Squonk42

If, as you seem to imply, a Domino PI basic is exactly equivalent in capability to a RaspberryPI then the QI pricing looks like blatant profiteering taking advantage of the (silly) high price of the Yun.

I know a Yun and a PI are not identical. But they each have features that the other lacks so I don't see, taken overall, why they should not retail at about the same price.

...R
The Domino Pi basic is the equivalent of a router such as the TP-Link TL-WR703N, based on the same SoC, i.e., it is a 400MHz-class 32-bit MIPS CPU with 64 MB DDR2 RAM and 16 MB SPI Flash, whereas the RPi is >800MHz, > 256MB DDR2 RAM and no Flash except SDCard. But The Domino Pi only consumes 1/2W and has built-in Wi-Fi and up to 3x Ethernet 10/100MB with integrated switch... So these 2 are not equivalent, but fills some overlapping needs.

As for the Qi, it includes an additional ATMega32U4 (list price $3.50 / 1000 pieces), some expensive voltage level translators, plus it requires dual-sided component mounting, which is also more expensive. It happened that we reached 1/2 of the price of the Yun, but that is just a coincidence, it was not a target :)

You may rather wonder why the Yun is twice as expensive, given the quantity they are selling  :smiley-mr-green:

Robin2

You may rather wonder why the Yun is twice as expensive, given the quantity they are selling
You may be sure that is exactly what started my line of questions.

I see no reason for the Yun to be more expensive than a Pi.

...R
Two or three hours spent thinking and reading documentation solves most programming problems.

Squonk42

You may be sure that is exactly what started my line of questions.

I see no reason for the Yun to be more expensive than a Pi.

...R

Charity vs. commercial? Volumes?

ShapeShifter

I see no reason for the Yun to be more expensive than a Pi.
Why do they charge more for a Yun? Because they CAN!

The cost of the parts, and the cost to manufacture, only sets the minimum selling price at which they can make a profit. Volume and production methods do enter into that formula. But it does not set the actual selling price. That is set by the perceived value to the potential customer, and the selling price is whatever the market will bear.

Squonk42

#20
Apr 22, 2015, 01:59 pm Last Edit: Apr 22, 2015, 02:02 pm by Squonk42
You are absolutely right!

But this particularly applies to the Yùn as it is the first Arduino board which is NOT Open Hardware (I mean, there is no way you can make a verbatim copy of the Yùn board with the provided documents: incomplete schematics, obsolete gerbers and missing BOM), otherwise someone would come up with a cheaper equivalent.

The Domino Qi OTOH will be released as Open Hardware, so if someone can make it cheaper, the end user will have the choice.

sonnyyu

...
The Domino Qi OTOH will be released as Open Hardware, so if someone can make it cheaper, the end user will have the choice.
Much Appreciated.  :)





sonnyyu

Is Raspberry Pi open hardware?

Quote
No.

If you want to build the ARM processor that drives it, the CPU/chip design is not available and you are going to have to pay ARM holdings to get it. No doubt under NDA so you don't share it with anyone else.

If you want to build the chip that the ARM processor lives in. The System On a Chip or SOC, you are going to have to talk to Broadcom who make it. I don't think they will be wanting to share the design of the GPU with you.

If you want to build the board that these chips are mounted on, I suspect the design may be available. I have not checked. However having that will do you no good if you cannot by the the Broadcom ARM Soc to mount on it, which you cannot.

In short, there is nothing "open" about the hardware.
https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=55777&p=422729





Squonk42

No, Raspberry Pi is not Open Hardware, but it is a charity, so they are not supposed to be driven by financial benefit.

Robin2

Why do they charge more for a Yun? Because they CAN!
That more or less what I thought.

But that is not really the spirit of OpenSource, is it?

Especially when they rely on us Forum members to provide free support.

...R
Two or three hours spent thinking and reading documentation solves most programming problems.

sonnyyu

FYI

Raspberry Pi's BCM2835 costs 400% more than Yun's AR9331 at industrial.

Obviously Raspberry Pi Foundation received special charity price from Broadcom.





ShapeShifter

But that is not really the spirit of OpenSource, is it?
OpenSource is basically about freedom of access to the design, and freedom to do what you want with it. I don't recall anything in the OpenSource manifesto that is at odds with the free market and making money off of your designs.

Of course, there is still the discussion about whether the Yun is truly OpenSource.

Robin2

Raspberry Pi's BCM2835 costs 400% more than Yun's AR9331 at industrial.

Obviously Raspberry Pi Foundation received special charity price from Broadcom.
So the charity price brings it down to the price of the AR9331 ?

I don't recall anything in the OpenSource manifesto that is at odds with the free market and making money off of your designs.
There is a difference between covering your costs and profiteering.

...R
Two or three hours spent thinking and reading documentation solves most programming problems.

Squonk42

#28
Apr 22, 2015, 09:35 pm Last Edit: Apr 22, 2015, 09:35 pm by Squonk42
So the charity price brings it down to the price of the AR9331 ?
Not only, Raspberry Pi sales passed 5 millions, that helps too:
http://techcrunch.com/2015/02/17/raspberry-pi-sales-pass-5-million/

Up to now, AR9331 is only reaching this figures (and probably much higher) with proprietary routers like TP-Link ones.

There is a difference between covering your costs and profiteering.

...R
Again, Open Source or Open Hardware philosophy is not against making profits, free market or capitalism, it is about sharing knowledge and freedom, and protecting these rights.

Robin2

the OpenSource manifesto
I thought I would do some reading but I can't find this.

Do you have a link to it?

...R
Two or three hours spent thinking and reading documentation solves most programming problems.

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