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tomb18

So what's up with the $$$Arduino YUN?  Has it ever been tested????
Got mine yesterday, sealed in a box from ABRA Electronics.  It's not a clone.
SO, plug it into my computer (PC) for power and proceed to look for the WifFi hot spot.
Not there.
Read all the setup tutorials etc.  So I tried a reset for more than 30 seconds, then tried a reset for 5-30 seconds and on and on...
Eventually, lo and behold a 10 second reset of the WLAN RST button seems to have worked.
I can connect.
Well the first thing that happens is that I get to the password section using arduino, it DOESN"T work.  Wow, strike TWO!
WOW, now i get the serial terminal and try to connect.  Well, although the IDE shows arduino UNO connected to COM24, there is no com24.  In fact the device manager does not show any comport when the arduino is plugged in and out.  I hear the beeps, but there is no connection to any port.  And I have enabled showing hidden devices.
So, I decide to uninstall the IDE (which was the latest version) and reinstall it.  Ok, but now all of a sudden after unplugging the YUN, there is no more WIFI again!
So what's up with this alpha device???
Where do I go from here?

New development....after holding reset for more than 30 seconds, and then waiting several minutes then pressing the WIFI RST for 10 seconds, I can now see the hotspot and can connect:  However when I enter 192.168.240.1 the page is always not available.

Where do I go from here? Raspberri Pi?

ShapeShifter

Pardon me if some of these questions are obvious, overly basic, or seem condescending, but while you tell of a lot of problems, you don't give many specifics about exactly how you are trying to do things - and the little details can make a big difference. Your experiences are not typical, so while it could be a problem with your board, it could also be a case of user error or misunderstanding the instructions.

First off, exactly which Yun do you have? Besides clones (which you say you don't have, but are you positive?) there is the unfortunate situation where the Arduino founders have had a difference of opinion and have split into two companies, both of which sell a version of the Yun, but with significantly different firmware. Sadly, this can cause a lot of confusion.

Got mine yesterday, sealed in a box from ABRA Electronics.  It's not a clone.
I took a look at https://abra-electronics.com/ and I can't find any Yun listed there, so I can't make a guess which one you might have. Next to the Ethernet connector, does it say "arduino,cc" or "arduino.org"? (Or something else?) Most of the tutorials you will find online (and all of them on this arduino.cc website) will assume you have one from arduino.cc, but the details may not apply to a board from arduino.org.

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SO, plug it into my computer (PC) for power and proceed to look for the WifFi hot spot.
Not there.
How long did you wait for it to show up? It takes well over a minute before the Linux side has fully booted up and the default WiFi hotspot is started. If you have an ardunio.cc board, the white USB LED should come on once Linux is (almost) fully booted, and the WiFi hotspot should appear shortly after that. I have no experience with an arduino.org board, so I don't know what the indication of boot complete might be (if any.)

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So I tried a reset for more than 30 seconds, then tried a reset for 5-30 seconds and on and on...
Are you pressing the "WLAN RST" button when doing this? Once you powered up, how long did you wait before starting to press that button? Unlike many devices where you do a reset by pressing/holding a button while powering up or shortly after power up, the Yun does not look for this button until it is fully booted. So apply power, wait for it to boot completely, and then press the button for the 5 or 30 seconds. Once releasing the button, it can take many minutes of flashing lights while the reset is performed, and then the full minute or so for it to fully boot once again.

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Eventually, lo and behold a 10 second reset of the WLAN RST button seems to have worked.
I can connect.
Once the WiFi hotspot showed up, what was the name? That can give you a clue to the firmware on the board: If the WiFi name started with "Arduino" then it's a good chance it's an arduino.cc board, but if the name contains "Linino" then it's probably an arduino.org board.

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Well the first thing that happens is that I get to the password section using arduino, it DOESN"T work.  Wow, strike TWO!
If it's an arduino.cc board, the default password should be "arduino" (case sensitive.) If it's an arduino.org board, I think the default password is "doghunter" (also case sensitive.) I don't know which setup tutorial you were using, so perhaps it was a tutorial for the opposite type of board that you have? (eg: and an arduino.cc tutorial with an arduino.org board, so you were using the wrong password?)

We have seen several people posting about not being able to log in with the default password. While there have been some work-arounds posted to reset the password, in most (if not all?) cases it has turned out that they had an arduino.org board and were trying to use "arduino" when that company's boards have a default password of "doghunter"

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WOW, now i get the serial terminal and try to connect.  Well, although the IDE shows arduino UNO connected to COM24, there is no com24.
In the lower right corner, the IDE will show you the last board type and port number that you had previously selected - it does not auto detect the board and show what is actually connected now. So, the most likely explanation is that the last time you used the IDE was with an Uno on com24.

When you select the "Port" menu in the IDE, it should show you the available ports, with a checkmark next to the currently selected port (if that port is currently visible - if no port is checked, that means that the currently selected port is not currently visible.)

Also, remember that before you build or upload any code to the Yun, you have to go into the board menu of the IDE and manually select "Arduino Yun" as the board type. (Although that only affects the build/upload process, it doesn't affect the detection of the serial ports.

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In fact the device manager does not show any comport when the arduino is plugged in and out.  I hear the beeps, but there is no connection to any port.  And I have enabled showing hidden devices.
So, I decide to uninstall the IDE (which was the latest version) and reinstall it.
It sounds like you have a device driver problem. Uninstalling/reinstalling the IDE is one way to fix that. It sounds like that might have worked for you?

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Ok, but now all of a sudden after unplugging the YUN, there is no more WIFI again!
Again, after plugging it back in, did you wait long enough for it to fully boot? It typically takes a bit more than a minute, which can seem like an eternity when you're waiting for the WiFi hotspot to appear.

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New development....after holding reset for more than 30 seconds, and then waiting several minutes then pressing the WIFI RST for 10 seconds, I can now see the hotspot and can connect:  However when I enter 192.168.240.1 the page is always not available.
The more I read, the more I'm thinking that you have an arduino.org board (the WiFi name contains the word "Linino") and if that's the case, they use a different default IP address. (I don't recall the address they use, but searching the arduino.org site for their version of the tutorial should give the answer.)

Back when the Arduino split happened earlier this year, and the bickering between the two sides started with both companies calling themselves Arduino, it seemed like the true losers in the argument would be the users who are confused about what board they are using and what instructions they should be following. It seems like your case might be a classic example of being hurt by the falling out between the companies?

tomb18

BINGO!!
It's a arduino.org board.
I did manage to get things going.  I needed to use a different computer.  My main development machine has 20+ serial and virtual serial ports (used for development in an unrelated area) so perhaps the IDE had difficulties here.
So I got another computer, and the IDE allowed me to connect via COM3.  I then rebooted the Linux side and entered passwd and changed it.
I then loaded the latest release of the LINUX.  Now all is well.
BUT, how does one get the address of the arduino yun after you configure it to join your network?  The docs say to enter name.local in your web browser but if i do, the browser can't resolve it (DNS i suspect).
So how do you get the address short of going back into linux and doing an ifconfig?

Well I did figure this out too.  If your arduino is plugged into the computer you are trying to access it from with the IDE, then the IDE  will not report the IP address.  Other computers will.  This is likely to be very confusing for an enduser that may get an arduino yun and be asked to configure it.  He will need to plug this into a different source of 5V.  This is kind of clunky.  Oh well.
Anyhow thanks for your detailed explanation. It's really unfortunate that I and probably many others will have to go through this due to the breakup of the company.  This is doomed to failure, i've seen this so many times and every time the companies just fade away.
Maybe it's time for raspberry...




tomb18

Hi,
I also think I loaded the wrong version of Linux on the YUN.  Seems there are different versions between the .ORG vs the .CC versions.  What a nightmare!
Which one do I use??
How do you search for directions, tutorials? ?

tomb18

It doesnt get any better.
So i unplugged the YUN from the PC and plugged it into a power source.  I then waited until the WAN light was on and then started the Arduino IDE.  Well, the PORT section is grayed out.  So I cannot use the IDE anymore.  It did work before.
So I opened a browser and it is there at 192.168.1.139 where its IP had been assigned.  I can upload a sketch, but all that happens is  it hangs uploading...
What a piece of junk and a total shame.  I dont even know where to look for help or examples.  The arduino.cc code examples don't exist anymore...Do I look here?  Or on some other forum dedicated to .ORG arduinos?
How in the world can you use this for any thing other than a TOY?  How can this be considered to be anywhere near being something other than ALPHA?  Don't the developers have any sense of pride?  This is a total piece of junk!  Just like the ethernet shield which pretty well acted the same.  Or maybe there was two versions of that one too?

ShapeShifter

#5
Dec 04, 2015, 03:43 pm Last Edit: Dec 04, 2015, 03:45 pm by ShapeShifter
The docs say to enter name.local in your web browser but if i do, the browser can't resolve it (DNS i suspect).
The name translation doesn't use DNS, it uses a zeroconf mechanism. This requires software on your computer to be able to translate the names. This software is installed by default on MacOS and iOS devices, not installed under Windows, available for Linux, and not available for Android. The simplest solution for Windows is to install Apple's Bonjour - this is automatically installed if you install iTunes or QuickTime, and can be manually installed by itself (look for Bonjour Printer Services.)

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Well I did figure this out too.  If your arduino is plugged into the computer you are trying to access it from with the IDE, then the IDE  will not report the IP address.  Other computers will.
This is not true. My Yun often shows up three times in the IDE, listed as it's USB serial port, it's WiFi address, and it's Ethernet address (both network addresses show up if I have both connected.) I've had lots of problems getting the network addresses showing up in old IDE versions, and I was one of the loudest complainers) but since loading 1.6.5 (from arduino.cc, I have no experience with arduino.org's version) the Yun's network address(es) have always shown up in the IDE, regardless of whether the USB port is plugged into the same computer or into a different power supply.

Knowing a little bit about how the serial ports and the network addresses are detected, I know that they are completely independent processes, and I can't imagine a scenario where one will interfere with the other. I suspect that you have something else going on, and it's just coincidence that it started showing up when you plugged into the other computer.

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It's really unfortunate that I and probably many others will have to go through this due to the breakup of the company.
Yes, it's the users who will lose in the long run. And also the people on this forum who are trying to help: this is the original forum hosted by the original company, which has been around for a long time.  The new company that split off is doing things differently enough that it is not only confusing for the users with their products and software, but it makes it more difficult here on this forum when we don't realize that it is people with a different company's product trying to get help on its company's forum. As time goes on, it's getting worse - fortunately, we are getting better at recognizing when this might be the case.



I also think I loaded the wrong version of Linux on the YUN.  Seems there are different versions between the .ORG vs the .CC versions.  What a nightmare!
Which one do I use??
I think the hardware is the same between the two companies, or at least close enough that it shouldn't make a difference. So you need to make a decision as to which company do you want to follow? You have three choices:
  • Load the arduino.cc OpenWRT firmware, the arduino.cc IDE, and come to this site/forum for help
  • Load the arduino.org Linino firmware, the arduino.org IDE, and go to to their site/forum for help
  • Continue to use an unknown or random/mixed version of software and forums, and continue to whine about your predicament.


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How do you search for directions, tutorials? ?
Pick a company, use their software, and use their web site/forum as your primary resource. Then, when searching other sites, assume they are talking about the arduino.cc version, since it has been around the longest. But be aware that there are different versions out there, and that some details may change. (The big three differences between arduino.cc's and arduino.org's firmware that I'm aware of are the default WiFi name, the default password, and the default IP address.)

Also be aware that there are other systems out there that are Yun clones or call themselves Yun compatibles, some of which come from Dragino, and which use yet a third set of firmware (but at least they dont call themselves arduino and don't have their own IDE.)



Well, the PORT section is grayed out.  So I cannot use the IDE anymore.  It did work before.
I have never seen or heard of this before. Perhaps you have a corrupted IDE installation, or a problem with your Java installation? (The IDE makes heavy use of Java.)

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So I opened a browser and it is there at 192.168.1.139 where its IP had been assigned.  I can upload a sketch, but all that happens is  it hangs uploading...
That could also be an IDE installation issue. But without posting more details, we can only guess. Seeing the output from the loading process would be very helpful.

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The arduino.cc code examples don't exist anymore...
What do you mean? They are right here.

Or are you saying that you don't see them in the IDE? If so, that could be another indication of a corrupted IDE installation. Or do you have the arduino.org version of the IDE installed? If so, they may have their own set of examples, so you need to look over there for help.

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Do I look here?  Or on some other forum dedicated to .ORG arduinos?
It all depends on whose software you are using: if you have arduino.cc's firmware and IDE installed, look here. If you have arduino.org's firmware and IDE installed, look over there for help. If you have a mixture of one company's firmware and the other company's IDE, then you will be on your own to figure out which side is causing the issue and where you should look for help.

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How in the world can you use this for any thing other than a TOY?  How can this be considered to be anywhere near being something other than ALPHA?  Don't the developers have any sense of pride?  This is a total piece of junk!
You very much remind me of my son: any time he ran into a problem, and it something didn't work perfectly on the first try, he would scream bloody murder about what a piece of junk that thing was. In his mind, any problems were always someone else's fault. I tried to teach him that when something goes wrong, and nobody else is complaining about the same problems, that it was very likely something he was doing wrong and not an inherent fault in the item. If only one person is experiencing a problem, is it more likely that the problem is with the product or the person? He would protest, but when he stepped back and looked at the situation closely and rationally, he would figure out that he was indeed doing something incorrectly. He always wanted the easy way out, and wanted the answer immediately handed to him with no effort on his part - but life doesn't work that way.

This sounds like a similar situation: the Yun has been around for a couple years now, and we've heard of (and solved) a lot of complaints and issues during that time. But this is the first time hearing of some of the things you are reporting. What is more likely: there have been hidden bugs that you are now discovering for the first time after two years, or perhaps you might be doing something differently (or have an unusual setup) that is triggering these issues?

Admittedly, the Yun is a complex piece of hardware, and it has it's quirks - there is definitely a learning curve associated with it. It's not an Uno; it's much more advanced than that. The Uno is a good bulletproof introduction to development boards, and great for a beginner. The Leonardo added some more advanced USB features, but also added some complexity to the equation: there are some quirks/tricks to getting the bootloader and serial port to work properly. The Yun is based on the Leonardo, so it shares the same quirks and limitations, and adds the Linux side and networking to the equation so it becomes much more complex. It is not a beginner's tool, and requires a more advanced approach to working with it. Experience helps solve any issues, and patience is a great help toward gaining that required experience.

Now we get to see how much you are like my son: he would never have the patience to read all of this, and I would've lost him after a couple paragraphs. Did you read all the way to the end? If so, then you just may have the determination to work through these temporary stumbling blocks and make some progress in your issues.

tomb18

"Now we get to see how much you are like my son: he would never have the patience to read all of this, and I would've lost him after a couple paragraphs. Did you read all the way to the end? If so, then you just may have the determination to work through these temporary stumbling blocks and make some progress in your issues."
Patience....yes, I learned C#, WIndows programming, web design and e-commerce from scratch in three months and put a product on the market.  And not a small trial product either (va2fsq.com)
Time? Yes, retired at 55.
Now, the general trend in the industry today is "ME TOO", lets get this out there and who cares if it doesn't work quite right.  Android, Apple, now Windows 10 it's quite disturbing.  I for one, am working on another commercial project and perhaps the "Arduino YUN" just doesn't have it.
I have 2 computers here.  One, on the ethernet (not wireless) works perfectly fine with the Ide.  The laptop, on wireless, on the same segment as the YUN, does not show a port, it is grayed out. I've installed Bonjour several times on that machine which is Windows 10.  The bonjour  browser shows it is not working however another tool I have does show that the service is working on the YUN.

So why depend on a third party product (especially from Apple) to make things work on Windows???  How fragile is that?  Why not fix ALL potential issues by offering the ability to enter an IP address?  How simple?

Doesn't make sense.  I cannot release something that "might" work for people and if it doesn't cause them lots of grief.  I've spent at least 15 hours on this which is way too much.

Ok, so lets say you can convince the end user to connect to his router (which may be possible or not) and then look up the address of the YUN.  Which router does he have? You can't possible have something like this in a manual.  Now lets say he can look it up.  Well the LINUX kernal you get for the YUN is missing the name of the machine in one of the files so when you look in the router, you see an address but you have no idea if it is a arduino. Sure I can fix this, but if a full reset is ever necessary what a mess for the end user.

"Continue to use an unknown or random/mixed version of software and forums, and continue to whine about your predicament."

I've installed both.  Everything from arduino.cc - no difference.  Everything from arduino.org no difference.
Again it comes down to the bonjour service not working in my windows 10 install.  What a horrible dependency. Something gets changed in a Windows update, bonjour stops working for those who get it to work, and all Arduino YUN installs in Windows die.  What a stupid design choice.

"SORRY, There is an error at our code repository, please inform to web@arduino.cc"  everywhere I go I get this error.  Perhaps it has something to do with the Chrome browser?  "Bridge Library", Console Read....every single one.

Makes no difference which PC I use.  Maybe this is all related?  Java?  Well I have Java 7 79, Java 6 update 29.  I have no problems developing on Android studio either.

There, read all the way lol.

My software has been on the market for two years and while it doesn't have the volume of the Arduino YUN, there are still obscure bugs being discovered 2 years later.

Nonetheless, I repeat, the solution of Bonjour is fragile, the follow ups by the developers inadequate, (name still not in Open wrt) and in general this is not worthy of being used commercially by a non-IT savvy person.  It can be made to work if I manually update names in the Linux install, write my own discovery routines, and then hope that the end user never needs to press reset...but this is not a real solution.

So how does one get bonbour to work?





ShapeShifter

Now, the general trend in the industry today is "ME TOO", lets get this out there and who cares if it doesn't work quite right.  Android, Apple, now Windows 10 it's quite disturbing.
Windows is just now following that trend? Surely you jest: I haven't seen any version yet of Windows that was mature and stable, starting with version 1.0 that I ran under MS-DOS. ;)

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I for one, am working on another commercial project and perhaps the "Arduino YUN" just doesn't have it.
Personally, I would never use a Yun, or any Arduino board, as the basis for a commercial product. It's a great hobbyist learning platform, and good for prototyping a product, but I wouldn't even think of using it commercially. That is not the intended audience. You would be much better off with a commercial or industrial controller, one which has some professional support behind it - and that doesn't include Raspberry Pi, Beagle Bone, or other hobbyist brands.

You clearly seek a professional development board and environment, with paid professional support. You won't find that here, you will have to go somewhere and pay for that support. What you will find here are a bunch of unpaid volunteers who generally like to help others, but they get turned off by constant complaints and people who demand immediate answers. We here are under no obligation to help: we are users of the product, just like you, and we help out because we want to, out of a sense of being in a community.

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"SORRY, There is an error at our code repository, please inform to web@arduino.cc"  everywhere I go I get this error.
Did you inform web@arduino.cc about it? Or are you waiting for someone else to do it for you?

I've seen that error, and not seeing the final code at the end of the page is not really a great loss, especially for the Yun examples which require some matching code on the Linux side, code which is not presented on the tutorial web page.

Forget about the final listing on the web page, all of the ready-to-execute code (including the Linux code missing from the web pages) is available as a pre-configured sketch under the examples menus of the IDE. The web page is just the documentation for the example code you already have.

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My software has been on the market for two years and while it doesn't have the volume of the Arduino YUN, there are still obscure bugs being discovered 2 years later.
Obscure bugs, yes. But do you really think having a bunch of basic usability problems with your board is an obscure bug?

If someone contacts you about a large range of fundamental usability problems that prevents doing even the most basic operations with your software, what are you going to consider first: that there is a fundamental basic flaw in your system that was never discovered before? Or that maybe they have something wrong with their setup or are using it incorrectly?

An obscure bug that only shows up under some unusual circumstance is one thing, but what you are complaining about is something entirely different.

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Nonetheless, I repeat, the solution of Bonjour is fragile,
Arduino is open source software written by a community of nameless volunteers. You are free to join in on the effort on GitHub and write a more robust solution. Just make sure it works under all operating systems, doesn't require any additional software to be installed on a target machine (which appears to be a requirement of yours that was not shared with the current development team.) You're more than welcome to add the feature about manually adding an IP address to the IDE, but then you still have the issue of figuring out what your Yun's address is, and trying to explain just what is an IP address to a neophyte who likely doesn't have any clue. Or, you could come up with your own scheme where the IDE uses a custom protocol to search for Yuns but they can be fragile, and that would only work on the IDE port menu, and not solve the issue using the name.local address with a web browser, SCP, SSH, or other access methods. As you no doubt know, it's not a trivial solution.

Personally, I  don't think that using Bonjour is a fatal flaw - it's widely used and generally stable, there are A LOT of computers out there that already have it, it's not hard to install if you need it, and it's a lot of work to develop/test/deploy a custom solution. Sure, it would be nice if it could be automatically installed with the IDE, but there are probably license issues involved with that.

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in general this is not worthy of being used commercially by a non-IT savvy person.
I don't think that was ever an intended audience for this board.

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It can be made to work if I manually update names in the Linux install, write my own discovery routines, and then hope that the end user never needs to press reset...but this is not a real solution.
It is clear to me that you will never be happy with the Yun, and you mostly want to complain. You might as well look for a different platform. Send your Yun to me, I'll be happy to give it a good home. ;)

In the mean time, if you do want to work through some issues, maybe someone else will volunteer their time to hold your hand, as I've already spent way too much time on this thread.

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So how does one get bonbour to work?
For most people, it's one step: install it.

LHR42

tomb18 - I concur anything with linino in it sucks don't waste your time explaining to these guys what went wrong so they can help you, your helping out that poor guy who thinks it would be fun to have one.

ballscrewbob

My yun was also a "steep learning curve" but coming from the regular Arduinos I sort of expected it as I read up a lot before I even opened the box.

Mine didnt like "LOCAL" either but let me in directly with the IP it showed in my router. which is mentioned in the help pages on most of the Yun sites.

The upgrade was a PITA but again that was my fault too for not taking as much notice of an error as I should have done.

Anyone coming from a simpler MCU to such as the YUN or even RasPi is going to be in for something of a culture shock and even more so if they are coming from a windows background and jumping right into Linux.

Am impressed with ShapeShifter's initial response as it is very detailed.
Please also remember almost all of us do this for FREE we don't get paid...Its enthusiast helping enthusiast wherever they can.

But fair game to part of LHR42 final response. But it is aimed at ABOVE entry / mid level as is seen HERE ...
It may not be the answer you were looking for but its the one I am giving based on either experience, educated guess, google or the fact that you gave nothing to go with in the first place so I used my wonky crystal ball.

LiamMcDonnell



Pick a company, use their software, and use their web site/forum as your primary resource. Then, when searching other sites, assume they are talking about the arduino.cc version, since it has been around the longest. But be aware that there are different versions out there, and that some details may change. (The big three differences between arduino.cc's and arduino.org's firmware that I'm aware of are the default WiFi name, the default password, and the default IP address.)


The Yuns offered on the online store at arduino.cc are branded arduino.org!  

ballscrewbob

Hi Liam
You are correct as mine is also .org but you also have to remember that both sides will be marketing each others goods through what amounts to a central sales organisation.

At least that's my understanding from the kiss and make up story between .org and .cc

It may not be the answer you were looking for but its the one I am giving based on either experience, educated guess, google or the fact that you gave nothing to go with in the first place so I used my wonky crystal ball.

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