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Topic: NE555 Timer Delay Module (Read 1 time) previous topic - next topic

NervusTwitch

#15
Aug 09, 2019, 01:53 am Last Edit: Aug 09, 2019, 01:55 am by NervusTwitch
Here's what I tried.

Instead of using the car battery I have an old bench test power supply that simulates running 12v car electronics in the house.

Only connecting the VCC and GND wires to power the "Power" led lights immediately but the other module LED never lights nor any clicks.
To be honest Im not really sure what I should expect. I tried to figure out how to trip the relay but relays are bit of weak spot for me.

What would be the simplest way to trip the relay for testing, not worried about testing with the blink function since I know I would need an electronic flasher? I assume just powering the module should eventually trip the relay.

BTW forgot to mention that the diagram shows LED's for lights but these are just your standard 3157 bulbs.

6v6gt

#16
Aug 09, 2019, 02:51 am Last Edit: Aug 09, 2019, 04:10 am by 6v6gt
When you apply power to the relay module via Vcc and Ground, a timer starts. As soon as the timer expires (after 1 to 10 seconds depending on the setting of the potentiometer) the relay should be energized and the blue led should switch on. The relay will stay energized until power is removed.

You have understood that the potentiometer is multi turn precision type. It may require 20 turns to travel from its minimum to its maximum value. Once it reaches an extremity, you can still turn the screw but it simply doesn't do anything. You may hear a very slight click on every rotation once it has reached the extremity, however.


NervusTwitch

When you apply power to the relay module via Vcc and Ground, a timer starts. As soon as the timer expires (after 1 to 10 seconds depending on the setting of the potentiometer) the relay should be energized and the blue led should switch on. The relay will stay energized until power is removed.

You have understood that the potentiometer is multi turn precision type. It may require 20 turns to travel from its minimum to its maximum value. Once it reaches an extremity, you can still turn the screw but it simply doesn't do anything. You may here a very slight click on every rotation once it has reached the extremity, however.


Thanks.
Yeah the blue led never lit nor any clicks.
Im thinking they are bad.

NervusTwitch

Update.

Finally got 1 module to actually adjust. Takes several turns just to make any noticeable changes.
Also to trigger the relay it needs more than 12v.

The 12v power supply I used wouldnt do it.

Straight to the car battery sitting around 12v after car not running all day made such a small click that if your finger wasnt on it you wouldnt know.

Start the car and relay has a good loud click,although another I tried had nothing ever trigger.

raschemmel

#19
Aug 09, 2019, 05:23 am Last Edit: Aug 09, 2019, 05:42 am by raschemmel
Can you post a schematic of your circuit before you added the relay modules that shows their normal wiring ?

Quote
Im thinking they are bad.  
Quote
but they all do the same thing so Im not sure if its a user error or possibly something up with the timers.
I'm thinking it's the wiring. I think there is something not right. First of all the chance of getting a bad relay module is super slim to begin with . The chance of getting multiple bad modules is like nil.
I don't like your schematic. Can you draw it differently so it is easier to see the wiring.

If I were you I would simply assume I made a big mistake and start over by putting everything back to the way it was and then add just one module. Have you taken any voltage measurements with a DMM ?
If you can remove the relay modules from the schematic and show how it was before you added them that would help.

NervusTwitch

#20
Aug 09, 2019, 06:22 am Last Edit: Aug 09, 2019, 06:29 am by NervusTwitch
Can you post a schematic of your circuit before you added the relay modules that shows their normal wiring ?
 


I'm thinking it's the wiring. I think there is something not right. First of all the chance of getting a bad relay module is super slim to begin with . The chance of getting multiple bad modules is like nil.
I don't like your schematic. Can you draw it differently so it is easier to see the wiring.

If I were you I would simply assume I made a big mistake and start over by putting everything back to the way it was and then add just one module. Have you taken any voltage measurements with a DMM ?
If you can remove the relay modules from the schematic and show how it was before you added them that would help.
The diagram I know isnt easy to read, I personally didnt draw it. I assume the relay diagram is what you are referring to as not liking.
As for the way the car was before adding anything, the schem is in post #7. Sorry if I didnt link the pic correctly, not a big forum user. But right clicking and open in new tab shows it much bigger.

I have put everything back to original then trying to add 1 module. I got the light without a module to work as normal for the car, then the light with the 1 module connected would only flash at same speed as the one without. The timing set screw would do nothing.


Ok original car circuit before anything added. Note the lights circled were 2 wire sockets replaced with Ford 3 wire sockets with colors corresponding to the other listed in this diagram:



The diagram for modules: The colors I used correspond with the car schematic above with exception of the red. The green wire on car was cut and module placed in between.



Hopefully this is easier to read and Im here because I do assume a mistake somewhere's, I just cant see it. Im following the color diagram exactly. Somewhat lost here.??

raschemmel

#21
Aug 09, 2019, 06:33 am Last Edit: Aug 09, 2019, 08:44 am by raschemmel
Let's try a different approach.
Foeget the car.
Pretend it doesn't exist.
Pretend you bought the module to delay a led string or whatever.
Wire it up as if you only doing that and see if it works. Make dure you use the Normally non- conductive contact and use a different circuit for the light you are switching that is NOT connected to the relay Vcc or GND. Two separate circuits. Two separate power sources.

If that works, then you can begin to isolate the issue by changing the wiring to one single supply.
If that works then you can move to step two and add the second module.
Finally , you should be able to simulate the car wiring before actually installing it in the car.

NervusTwitch

Here's what i got so far.

I went through all 5 one at a time. Only connected VCC and GND to the car battery.

3 would trigger the relay immediately. No matter how much I turned the pot no changes at all in delay. Counter clockwise is suppose to increase dealy. I turned for a full 2 minutes just to be sure in clockwise,never a change.

4th on would never trigger with same technique above.

Then the 5th of which I never hooked up or tried, still in package worked just as it was suppose to.

To me this sounds like I messed up in the beginning by mistakenly shorting something and toasted the 4 I kept trying. Only thing I can think of.

I mean at this point they are so cheap I may just order so more. Im sure they werent bad but I have my moments where I dont realize something I did then poof....lol.

As for raschemmel comment, sorry Im not quiet sure what you mean, I am by no means great at this stuff but I usually learn as I go for what Im needing to do over the years and these modules are new to me. Ive dealt with relays in cars, car alarms and such but not like these.
 

raschemmel

#23
Aug 09, 2019, 07:52 pm Last Edit: Aug 09, 2019, 07:58 pm by raschemmel
Quote
As for raschemmel comment, sorry Im not quiet sure what you mean, I am by no means great at this stuff but I usually learn as I go for what Im needing to do over the years and these modules are new to me. Ive dealt with relays in cars, car alarms and such but not like these.
I don't know which comment you are referring to so I am going to assume you mean the following:

Quote
I'm thinking it's the wiring. I think there is something not right. First of all the chance of getting a bad relay module is super slim to begin with . The chance of getting multiple bad modules is like nil.
I don't like your schematic. Can you draw it differently so it is easier to see the wiring.

If I were you I would simply assume I made a big mistake and start over by putting everything back to the way it was and then add just one module. Have you taken any voltage measurements with a DMM ?
If you can remove the relay modules from the schematic and show how it was before you added them that would help.
A word of advice , from a professional technician:
I have done thousands of projects in the past 38 years and they almost alway follow the same pattern:
1. Engineer designs something.
2. Engineer tells me to build prototype.
3. Engineer gives me shipping reciept of some number to pick up parts from shipping/receiving.
4. I pick up parts.
5. I unpack and organize parts.
6. I test all parts.
7. Everything that works correctly gets received for the project.
8. Anything that doesn't work gets set aside for engineer to inspect before contacting vendor.
9. I build prototype.
10. I test prototype.



In view of the above, do you think it would be possible to build the prototype with bad parts ?
Remember what deep throat said : "Trust No-one !"

Well you buy something , don't build anything with it until you've done your due diligence as
Shipping Receiving.


Out of curiosity, what was the battery voltage when you tested the 4 units ?

NervusTwitch

Good advice.

Normally I would check something like that but I didnt.
Honestly I think I messed them up not paying attention, wouldnt be the first time. Also I remember now in the beginning blowing the blinker fuse and remember that is when my issues started. That fuse slipped my mind. Age I guess is catching up to me..lol.

The car battery was between 12.5v-13v, hooked up a slow charger on it so to make sure I had enough volts with the car off.

I knew my problems were most likely user error but couldnt put my finger on where.

raschemmel

#25
Aug 09, 2019, 08:18 pm Last Edit: Aug 09, 2019, 09:15 pm by raschemmel
Pop quiz:

BEFORE you connected the FIRST module, did you or did you not measure the voltage on the wires you were about to connect to it ?


Quote
That fuse slipped my mind. Age I guess is catching up to me..lol.  
How old are you ?

NervusTwitch

#26
Aug 09, 2019, 09:40 pm Last Edit: Aug 09, 2019, 09:42 pm by NervusTwitch
Yes I measured the volts at the cars harness where I connected. Dont remember the exact volts since that was last weekend but it was around 12v.

As for my age, Im not old but I have conditions that affect my memory and cause me not to always think properly, kind of like a foggy brain. And that 1st day I messed with all this I had that foggy feeling.

I have severe nerve damage and what Dr's call me is a very bad brittle diabetic.
I take 5-10 shots daily of 2 different insulins, sometimes more.

Due to that and over 20yrs of being a diabetic when having insulin reactions the Dr tells me those have the same affect as using illegal drugs,causing to kill off brain cells causing memory issues.

Add that with the severe nerve damage throughout my entire body is also causing memory issues.
Long term memory is good but over the last 5 or so years learning or remembering new things is an issue.

Ex would be my guitar. Been playing since I was 13 and can play all that stuff I learned from then but after learning new things now I forget them very soon,talking like within a month. Can still play Bass, but no longer remember how to play drums and my muscle memory functions are whacked too.

As for my age,I'll be 44 in less than a month, I know not old but my body disagrees and also considered %100 disabled.

raschemmel

Sorry to hear about the diabetes .
I'm 70 and still working full time as a technician. My job requires a lot of memory work. When I worked at Apple I was responsible for knowing the exact location all the parts at any time of the day. I created a spec
called TTF ('Time To Find') and my target spec was 1 minute. I was within spec at least half the time.
While my memory for inventory related things is excellent , I have trouble remembering events, like what I did yesterday. Every day seems like yesterday so I can't remember if I did something yesterday or last week. I told my boss, "Ask me where anything is, but don't ask me what I did yesterday."

NervusTwitch

#28
Aug 09, 2019, 10:40 pm Last Edit: Aug 09, 2019, 10:46 pm by NervusTwitch
Yep, that not remebering what I did even 10 mins ago is an issue for me. I know exactly what your talking about.

There are times Im talking to my wife and right in the middle of the sentence I just forget what Im even saying and sometimes I have to ask her what I was even talking about.

She used to give me a hard time about it but she's catching up to my age now and is realizing how I am. She's 9 years under me and not giving me so much a hard time anymore....lol.

Im wishing I could go back to work full time but not going to happen. I still work what I can and what disability allows but I went from working many hours weekly to almost nothing.

I even started working at my dad's company when I was 12 on telecommunications systems.I would run cables,wire jacks and other similar things for him on weekends and after school. We would run cables and such for systems up to 500 lines in large office buildings.

He paid me just as he would hired help. At times I made upto $400 a week at 12yrs old in the 80's. That was alot for a kid back then.


raschemmel

Yeah, don't get me started on the wife thing. As an electronics engineering tech I am a packrat and she never stops asking me to throw stuff out and I almost never comply. When I no longer need something
I give it away.

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