Arduino Due External Power Supply and Serial USB connection same time ?

i have a arduino due board and i have read so many topic related external power source and usb connection related but i didn't get solution . so my question is

  1. Am i connect my external power source 12v 5A and USB port (both programming or native) same time?

  2. or can i remove 2 fuse on USB port(both programming or native) and then connect external power supply and USB for safe power supply?

In my application i used 15 Digital Input and Output and 10 Analog Read and Write using arduino due so i need serial monitor to reading.

if any solution then please give me answer.

Good morning,
I also asked myself the same question (No. 1) with an Arduino Due,

nick_avr:

  1. Am i connect my external power source 12v 5A and USB port (both programming or native) same time?

The goal was to relieve the intensity of the ports on my laptop.
The Due had to be connected directly to a USB port to receive position commands transmitted through the USB serial port.
In order to have a maximum stability of the PWM outputs in 12 bits, I think to use an external power supply Mean Well RS15-12 (12v under 1.3A) having in OUTPUT:
RIPPLE & NOISE (max.) 120mVp-p
VOLTAGE TOLERANCE ±1.0%
LINE REGULATION ±0.5%
LOAD REGULATION ±0.5%
SETUP, RISE TIME 1000ms, 30ms/230VAC at full load
HOLD UP TIME (Typ.) 70ms/230VAC at full load

How to obtain an OUTPUT PWM TIMER with the least interference and the most stable possible?
Question A
Is this power supply Mean Well RS15-12 adapted to my use in order to have the most stable OUTPUT PWM Timer in 12bits 10Khz?
https://www.google.fr/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=6&ved=2ahUKEwiR1KmqxIvnAhVBQhoKHfeIDKAQFjAFegQIBxAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.meanwell.com%2FUpload%2FPDF%2FRS-15%2FRS-15-SPEC.PDF&usg=AOvVaw2HWmahVNZkOeybO6tWOJbB

Question B
I was considering to get the 10Khz frequency by modifying the variant file. h
Is there a simple method to increase the PWM Timer frequency without modifying variant.h?

Question C
Is it useful to put between the output of this power supply and the jack plug of the Due a low-pass RC filter of the style 10 Ω / 47µF ? (see bottom right of the link)
Is the addition of a low pass filter 10Ω / 47µF useful, in your opinion, because a 47µF capacity is also visible to the right of the self between Vin and GND?
Does the addition of an extra low pass filter 10 Ω / 47µF bring a gain in voltage stability?
https://www.google.fr/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=2ahUKEwjdnLmJr-DnAhUDDmMBHTCECY4QFjAAegQIARAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.arduino.cc%2Fen%2Fuploads%2FMain%2Farduino-Due-schematic.pdf&usg=AOvVaw10bt06bpgE9nriqNjdkZ35

Question D
Is there a difference between an external power supply of the Due via the Vin socket located next to the 2 GND connectors and a power supply via the 2.1mm “jack” socket?
Through the 2.1mm jack there seems to be an MH2029-300Y filter choke before the Vin circuit. (see bottom right of the link)
So the “jack” plug only supplies external power through the Vin connector on the PCB next to the 2 GNDs?

Additional information on the use of USB (500mA)
The other 2 PC USBs must be equipped with a HUB with external power supply. These USB hubs power gaming peripherals that can be hungry for power.

Thank you for your technical support

nick_avr:
i have a arduino due board and i have read so many topic related external power source and usb connection related but i didn't get solution . so my question is

  1. Am i connect my external power source 12v 5A and USB port (both programming or native) same time?

  2. or can i remove 2 fuse on USB port(both programming or native) and then connect external power supply and USB for safe power supply?

In my application i used 15 Digital Input and Output and 10 Analog Read and Write using arduino due so i need serial monitor to reading.

if any solution then please give me answer.

Have a look at the store web page for the Arduino Due. Under Documentation you will find your answer regarding the power. You can also look at the schematics and see how the Arduino guys have done the automatic switching.

https://store.arduino.cc/arduino-due

If anything is unclear feel free to ask. I thought it might help you better, to find the answer yourself.

Klaus_K:
Have a look at the store web page for the Arduino Due. Under Documentation you will find your answer regarding the power. You can also look at the schematics and see how the Arduino guys have done the automatic switching.

Arduino Due | Arduino Official Store

If anything is unclear feel free to ask. I thought it might help you better, to find the answer yourself.

Yes Brother i understand all about automatic switching of power supply on dc jack and usb port.

but is the safe way to handle with p- channel mosfet ?

what about my second option?

please reply me!

nick_avr:
what about my second option?

Have a look at the schematic. If you remove F2 the USB power (USBVCC2) will no longer be connected to ATMEGA16U2 pin 31. In the datasheet of the ATmega16u2 (page 185ff) you can see this pin powers the USB interface with an internal regulator. I suspect that means this USB interface will no longer work.

The SAM3X has a VBUS Power Measurement Port. It looks like this is connected before the fuse. The schematic uses two different labels XUSB/2.3B and XUSB/1.1A. So, I am not 100% sure.

On the other side the ATmega has a sense input to detect USBVCC. I am not sure what the firmware does when it does not detect the signal because you removed F1 but the SAM3X has USB power.

This is probably not what you would have liked to hear. Sorry.

Good morning,

Klaus_K:
Have a look at the schematic. If you remove F2 the USB power (USBVCC2) will no longer be connected to ATMEGA16U2 pin 31. In the datasheet of the ATmega16u2 (page 185ff) you can see this pin powers the USB interface with an internal regulator. I suspect that means this USB interface will no longer work.

The SAM3X has a VBUS Power Measurement Port. It looks like this is connected before the fuse. The schematic uses two different labels XUSB/2.3B and XUSB/1.1A. So, I am not 100% sure.

On the other side the ATmega has a sense input to detect USBVCC. I am not sure what the firmware does when it does not detect the signal because you removed F1 but the SAM3X has USB power.

This is probably not what you would have liked to hear. Sorry.

Being a novice in electronics, I don’t foresee having to unsolder a component of the Arduino Due to be able to supply the board externally via the 2.1mm jack plug while keeping the USB serial link between the Due and the PC operational.
Without removing a component, what happens if the USB is connected to a PC for the serial data link and an external power supply is connected to the 2.1mm jack:
1-> External power supply and USB power supply in short circuit ?
2-> External power supply shunted and unused as long as USB is connected to the PC switched on?

3-> The solution to be able to power the Arduino Due card and keep the USB link between the Due and a PC active is not to modify the USB type A male plug of the cable by removing power supply tracks 1 and 4 ?

Greetings

USB A sans Alim 5v.jpg

In my application i used 15 Digital Input and Output and 10 Analog Read and Write using arduino due so i need serial monitor to reading.

Digital inputs take no current.
15 Digital outputs do not use more than 45 mA. Each digital pin can only drive 3mA.

So the USB cable should be able to supply plenty of current for operation of your Due.
The USB cable can supply External electronics connected to 5V pin or to 3.3V pin with 400mA.

Since you want Serial comms, you always need the USB cable.
I see no point in using external power supply at all.

However some external electronics might use high currents e.g. motors or big TFT displays.
In which case you use external power for supplying the motor board, ... i.e. Amperes.
The Due is only providing digital control signals. i.e. a few mA.

David.

Hello,

david_prentice:
I see no point in using external power supply at all.

for the unanswered questions A , C and D of the 2nd post (#1)

How to have the most stable 12-bit PWM Output in 10kHz (less parasitic peaks)?

Seriously. The USB voltage is reasonably steady. The Due 3.3V regulator is going to produce a clean 3.3V from a "noisy" USB 5V.

A 12-bit PWM output signal is going to produce a trivial current load. After all, a Due pin can only source 3mA or sink 6mA.
The logic switching edges should be satisfied by the local decoupling capacitors.

I have never looked at the Due PWM on an oscilloscope. If your PWM pin is driving a 1k0 resistive load I would expect a pretty clean signal.

How are you loading the PWM pin?

David.

david_prentice:
Seriously. The USB voltage is reasonably steady. The Due 3.3V regulator is going to produce a clean 3.3V from a “noisy” USB 5V.

I thought I would have to use an external power supply and USB only the serial link maintained because on the PC the 2 other USB will be connected to 2 HUBs with also an external power supply.
These USB HUBs will mainly supply power to the flight controls of the aircraft simulator

The external power supply of the Arduino Due also allows an emergency stop to be carried out for safety reasons by switching off all external power supplies.
( Due + AOP 324n + CI controlling the direction of rotation of the 380V three-phase motors at the frequency inverter )

david_prentice:
How are you loading the PWM pin?

A) I would use a maximum of 6 pins from PWM Timer 2, 3, 4, 5 and 10, 11, 12, 13
PWM resolution will be 12 bits at 10kHz.

B) The 12bits / 10kHz PWM signal will be converted to analog by a low-pass RC filter of order 2.
RC 10kΩ-100nF then RC 10kΩ-47nF see result of old test with PWM 50% on which we can see the PWM peaks I was talking about under 100% USB (serial link and power supply)
Note: The yellow curve is the analog output (0.5V calibration), the PWM is displayed with a 1V calibration.

C) The analog signal is amplified by an AOP LM324N with a gain to obtain 10v when PWM 100% and 0v if PWM 0%.

D) At the AOP output, the 0v to 10v controls a VFD frequency control setpoint.
The frequency inverter to use its maximum accuracy requires an LSB of 5mV (2000 voltage steps between 0v and 10v)
The input charge is 20 kΩ

Note :
To minimize processing delay, I hesitate between a second order low-pass filter RC 10kΩ-100nF then RC 22kΩ-47nF and a single first order low-pass filter RC 22kΩ-100nF

Variateur Contacts Consigne de Vitesse.jpg

++How to pull up 0-3.3v PWM signal to 0-10v PWM signal.jpg

Hiii Tfou57

I used ATSAM3X8E, PWM module once for operating the three phase inverter and experienced the mall operation of the designed application. After quiet a while I understood that, we cannot use this module which ever way we want. It is better to use the module in simple configuration as much as possible.

I have seen your oscilloscope waveform. from my analysis the interference which you are talking about is dependent on many different factors which we can classify as

  1. Hardware dependent interference, means the Micro-controller pins catch the signal from other sources of noise.
  2. The second one is, interference occurrence due to internal peripherals.

So feel free to share your code if possible other wise I cant say any thing about your problem.

If there is any wrong in my analysis please inform me

Hello chamarthi

chamarthi:
Experienced the mall operation of the designed application.
After quiet a while I understood that, we cannot use this module which ever way we want.
It is better to use the module in simple configuration as much as possible.

I don't really understand what your feedback is telling you and what precautions you should take.
Can you expand on your quote above?

VFD for what purpose?

With which hardware interface?

My use must be retractable and precise for a correct management of the PID of the 380v Tri motor.
The shaft outputs of the geared motors will be fitted with connecting rods and will only rotate + or - 60 degrees.

:slight_smile: :slight_smile:

"How to obtain an OUTPUT PWM TIMER with the least interference and the most stable possible?"

I reacted for the above question actually.

I worked on BLDC motor control. I got unnecessary interference effects from the designed circuit in my case, I thought you also facing the same problem. It's okk cool. "Their is a miss communication"

anyways good luck