Best layout/simulation software for Arduiono projects?

I need a program to help me layout my circuit and then convert it to a PCB for manufacture.

It also needs to do Arudino UNO simulation to test the design.

A big plus is if it already knows how to put the uno circuit into the diagram so that I can make it a 1 board solution. If not that, if it knows how to make an arbitrarily sized "hat" that would work too.

Unfortunately, if that was a single EDA product, it couldn't sustain the development costs for such a small customer base. Even the top end packages can cost tens of thousands for a complete licence with all features.

You could look at high end EDA packages, and some of them may have Arduino libraries to 'help', but as soon as a new product arrives, you'll have to wait for someone to create new component libraries - or do it yourself... back to the learning curve.

The overlapping schematic capture, pcb layout and simulation - along with component selection and validation takes many man-years to get right... and even then is prone to human error.

Sorry, start reading.

A big plus is if it already knows how to put the uno circuit into the diagram so that I can make it a 1 board solution.

A successful product might include the ATMega328 processor used in the Uno, but not most of the other bits.

People use various schematic capture / pcb layout tools - Eagle seems popular with this forum. Free limited licence.

The arduino circuits and layouts are also free - look on this forum for the bits you need and modify as appropriate.

Simulation?

Build a prototype by whatever means (incorporating an existing arduino product?) and use that.

Allan

Simulation is usually unnecessary. You can buy many Arduinos for much less than any simulation software.

Eagle is what I use to draw schematics and circuit boards. It always keeps the schematic and the board "synchronised" so any component added to the schematic appears on the board.

KiCad is also a popular choice.

I don't think I've ever heard of a layout/schematic package that includes simulation of microcontroller-level electronics (some will interface to SPICE, which does simulation mostly at the analog circuit layer, as far as I know.)

At least, nothing at the level that mere mortals can afford.

You can get Verilog/VHDL models of various processors, and use the simulators for those languages.

That's probably how they designed them in the first place.

Jolly hard work. And not cheap.

Buy a bit of hardware - it's the real thing!

Allan

Probably the first thing you can get 'into' is drawing schematics by hand - suitable for most Arduino projects.
Then as others suggested - find a schematic capture program - Eagle etc, to do it properly.

Eagle (et-al) are a big step if you don't know what you're doing in the first place - and Fritz' diagrams are a very bad place to start - they are pin/connection diagrams - nothing to do with schematics - and virtually useless for development debugging.

So to be clear, I already have a wire-wrapped prototype working.

I'm just nervous that I will mess up somehow transferring that to a diagram and not realize til after I've speent the significant $$ getting a board made and populated.

Maybe Im being over-cuatious but this is my first hardware product project.

profk:
So to be clear, I already have a wire-wrapped prototype working.

I'm just nervous that I will mess up somehow transferring that to a diagram and not realize til after I've speent the significant $$ getting a board made and populated.

Maybe Im being over-cuatious but this is my first hardware product project.

You can't be too cautious when you're laying out a PCB. But CAD is tied to a schematic, it's pretty easy to proof the schematic. Just do it 3 times, once on a different day. :slight_smile:

profk:
So to be clear, I already have a wire-wrapped prototype working.

I'm just nervous that I will mess up somehow transferring that to a diagram and not realize til after I've speent the significant $$ getting a board made and populated.

Maybe Im being over-cuatious but this is my first hardware product project.

Shit happens. Check, check again, double check, triple check, then right before you hit BUY check it one last time. Then check it again because there never is "one last time".

The most common error is incorrect pinout on the component's footprint. Maybe you're used to the CBE order of BJTs, so you assumed your MOSFET pinout was DGS. Oops.

Maybe you thought the pin diagram in the datasheet was a top view, but it was actually a bottom view. Oops.

Maybe in transferring from the board to the schematic you forgot to make some connection. Oops.

Maybe you reversed two similar, but different pins, like the inputs of an op amp. Oops.

Simulators for microcontroller projects are IMO nearly useless - they just don't do a good job of simulating what the microcontroller is doing (in terms of taking the code and figuring out the behavior from that).

Eagle is where it's at for schematics/layout work.

Expect that the first rev of every board design you have manufactured will end up in the trashcan. Sometimes you'll get it on the first try, particularly with experience, but you shouldn't expect it, no matter how many times you look over your design.

I just botched the silkscreen on a batch of boards recently ($80 mistake) myself...

Shit happens. Check, check again, double check, triple check, then right before you hit BUY check it one last time. Then check it again because there never is "one last time".

When I was designing mobile phones some years ago, I always tried to get an experienced engineer from another team to have a last look at a layout before pressing the 'go' button -which could cost >£10,000.

You can be so close to the design as to miss obvious stupid errors.

I sometimes did this last look for other teams - occasionally we caught something and saved a lot of time, money and embarrassment - especially if the client was breathing down your neck!.

Sometimes mistakes are beyond your control. On one occasion the PCB manufacturer got a couple of buried layers swapped in an 8-layer design. The connectivity was fine - but the swapping of a ground and signal layer destroyed the RF performance. That took some finding!

Allan

You also will end up with a few "green wire" changes on your first board. My first PCB, I forgot to wire power to one of the important components. A bit of wire soldered to the board quickly bridged that gap.

Other PCB's I've made have had tracks cut, component legs lifted and other components stood on end to fit where they were forgotten.