Confused Newbie Two IDE's?

Hello everyone, I am new to the world of microcrontrollers and electronics. My ultimate goal is to make my knitting machine talk to my computer See this hack. Anyway, I just receicved my Arduino in the mail, but the documentation directs me to Arduino.org. :confused: I've read up a bit and understand there are some legal troubles. My question is: Does this mean there are now two IDE's? I think I have the one that is on Arduino.cc as it is in the Linux mint repos. Or are they both the same? Can I ask questions on these forums.? (Well I think I just have :) ....

Edited Title to be more descriptive.

Yeah - there's a bit of a legal problem (ok - actually, it sounds like a large legal problem) going on between the founders of the Arduino (arduino.cc) and the (original) manufacturer of the Arduino board (now arduino.org).

Short (but likely not wholly correct) version: The founders needed a board manufacturer - they brought this guy on board to help make them in Italy (not sure if any money/shares changed hands as a part of the deal - or if there was a paperwork contract, or just a verbal agreement - like I said, it's a thorny legal issue, from what I have seen), and essentially behind the original founders backs, the guy files for an actual trademark on the Arduino name, gets a new domain (arduino.org) - and (I think) starts doing his own marketing.

It is my belief that he did this to try to wrest control of the Arduino (lock-stock-and-barrel) from the founders, who basically trusted him; he wants to make a ton of money - the founders are more interested in spreading the Arduino "love" by going international in some manner (don't get me wrong - they are making money and need to make money to keep this site going, etc). At any rate, I think (I don't really -know- anything; that's for the courts) that the guy is trying really hard to pull a fast one.

Now - for newbies like you (and maybe even some others!) there's a bit of confusion in the marketplace. Personally, I side with the founders on this - I will be might chuffed if the courts or such rule in the other guy's favor. I can see it potentially fracturing the community - not that everybody will stop using the Arduino ecosystem, but that this community (ie - these forums, etc) - might break up or even (horror!) be shut down; all of this data over the past several years GONE.

Or - we might see something as what (I have only recently learned) happened to "Let's Make Robots" (although that was a perfectly legal sale - from what I understand) - basically it was sold, but many of the users and contributors of it (some of them long time and influential) could not or did not want to abide by the new owners "rules" (not sure what that was - but if I had to guess, the rules changed from "you own your content" to "WE own YOUR content") - and they up and left. Many of the tutorials and such "disappeared" from the site (whether by the users/contributors hands - or by the owners - I don't know) - but it basically somewhat imploded. And that was with a perfectly (?) legal sale of the site to a new owner (!).

Imagine that happening here - but due to an arguably very hostile (and likely shady) takeover...

Ugh. :(

Oh - I guess I should answer your questions - heh:

Mrayes: Anyway, I just receicved my Arduino in the mail, but the documentation directs me to Arduino.org.

Yeah - my advice would be for you to get familiar with the issue, then decide which side you want to use. But let me let you know - this site (arduino.cc) and these forums have been here since at least 2009, and I think a bit earlier (2008? 2007?). All of that content, all of that expertise - it's here, and the really old stuff (back before the site changed what bulletin board software it used) has been archived (read only for that really old stuff). The "old-timers" are all here. This is -the home- of the Arduino community - love it or not, I guess.

Mrayes: I've read up a bit and understand there are some legal troubles.

The word "some" is a bit of an understatement - as I noted in my first post, this whole situation reeks of an extremely hostile takeover - and likely a very illegitimate one as well. Ultimately, for better or worse, the courts will decide.

Mrayes: My question is: Does this mean there are now two IDE's?

That I am not sure of - maybe. If you see an IDE on the arduino.org site - or if it has a Github repo - check out the version info; check out the code (if you understand it). Likely - they have changed it, branded it for themselves, and make no mention of arduino.cc or the founders.

For what it's worth - IIRC (or it may have been removed) - the "official" IDE from arduino.cc had a check in it to pop up a message saying that the board being used was "unofficial" - it wouldn't stop the compile or upload - it would just "warn" the user. I'm not sure why they did it - whether it was "dig" at the arduino.org owner(s) - or if it was something else. But they had a way of reading the Arduino (maybe the USB ident stuff?) - and spitting out the message.

Mrayes: I think I have the one that is on Arduino.cc as it is in the Linux mint repos. Or are they both the same?

Likely the one in the repo is from here (arduino.cc) - as I noted, this whole thing by arduino.org is a market fragmentation and takeover attempt (IMHO) - but I don't think they have everyone on board or "fooled". But - as this thing drags on (and it will, the court system being what it is) - this confusion will continue, and it is inevitable that the arduino.org stuff will seep into other places, furthering the confusion.

It should also be noted that one of the very late models of the Arduino (I think the Due?) is wholly owned by arduino.org - not arduino.cc; I think that board was dropped (? someone correct me!) from the arduino.cc IDE - but it (of course) remains in the .org IDE (if there is a seperate one - which I think is the case?). So if you have that board (or any others made by arduino.org) - you might have to use that IDE...

:(

Mrayes: Can I ask questions on these forums.?

Of course! We (try) to welcome everyone - and I personally won't hold it against a newbie who has been confused by this issue - as it isn't very clear, and took me a bit to understand it (and I still think I don't know much), and I've been around here since 2009. Just continue to study the issue from time-to-time, keep tabs on it - but don't stress over it (because there ain't anything you can do 'bout it!). Instead, focus on your project and learning the Arduino, and becoming part of this community.

Because ultimately - WE are the Arduino - even if both arduino.org and arduino.cc ceased to exist tommorow, this community (but maybe not this forum) will always be around - and something new would pop up to replace things. I am absolutely certain of it (if I have to do it myself, I will).

:)

Dangit >:( :( , I wanted to do the right thing too. Ordered the wrong board it seems. The whole reason I got interested in Arduino is because of the community around it. I mean there are other boards. Reminded me of the Ubuntu community, at least how it was in the beginning before the exodus of all the oldtimers. Welcoming and no RTFM or community ¨Managers". Whole reason I got into Linux.

Anyway I digress...I´m going to try to send the board back. See what they say and guess I will be ordering a Genuino from Arduino.cc instead. I just wanted it quicker, is why I decided to order locally. Anyway. Thank you for answering my questions and the welcome. :) It clears a lot up and might help other newbies like myself make their decision.

The Mint Repos have an older version 1.0.5 of the IDE. Not too fussed about that, as I usually don like to use the latest and Iḿ only going to be blinking leds etc in the beginning anyway or am I missing something by not downloading the latest version?

ps. I Think the IDE is now forked, but prefer to stick with the Arduino.cc version for reasons stated above

pps. The plot thickens..Most of the official resellers from the links here on Arduino.cc sell the arduino.org boards. they refer customers to Arduino.org for downloads There is one that appears to be selling maybe an old arduino board? and refers to Arduino.cc for the latest IDE update. Pfff!

ppps. The Genuino board appears to be a different board from the Uno. It uses an Intel chip. Sigh. I think Iḿ going to find myself a Sparkfun board instead from before the fork. The tutorials I want to follow use the Atmel chip.

I don't think you need to worry so much about where you got your current board. If you've already got it you probably don't need to return it unless you really want to. An Uno is an Uno and it should work with the IDE from arduino.cc. The design (layout and schematic) of the board is the same, it may just have arduino.org or arduino.cc stamped on it. Sparkfun Redboard and Adafruit Metro328 are essentially same thing as Uno. Adafruit makes and sells the Made in USA official Arduino Uno's (for arduino.cc), if you're in the USA.

The Intel chip you are thinking about is on the Arduino/Genuino 101. The Uno still has the ATMEL ATmega328P chip on it no matter what the manufacturer is. In fact, if you get some other Arduino such as a Nano with ATmega328P on it, if you write the Uno bootloader onto it, it will be an Uno as far as the IDE is concerned.

Hello Mrayes,

It’s saddening that you got confused by the shenanigans, I think that the .org group is profiting from your confusion. There are also in circulation some counterfeit boards sold through ebay. If you cannot easily get an arduino.cc board (USA only) or a Genuino board (elsewhere on the planet, and still made with the blessing of arduino.cc) then the Sparkfun Redboard is a good choice, also blessed by arduino.cc, and will behave exactly as an Arduino.cc Uno.

The situation is a pity because the money that should be going to progress is instead going to lawyers on both sides of the fight. And as progress has splintered, the fumbled ball is being picked up by other teams.

Hmm.. Here is what they say on their github page 'Credits' section: https://github.com/arduino-org/Arduino

Arduino.org is an open source project, developed by many and based on:

The Arduino.cc IDE: http://www.arduino.cc/ The Wiring project: http://www.wiring.org.co/ The Processing project: http://processing.org A special thanks to Daniela Antonietti, Hernando Barragán, David Cuartielles, Ben Fry, Tom Igoe, Gianluca Martino, David A. Mellis, Massimo Banzi and Casey Reas for their works and inspirations.

Arduino uses the GNU avr-gcc toolchain, avrdude, avr-libc, and code from Processing and Wiring.

Icon and about image designed by ToDo

Well it's nice they give credit. I don't know a lot about navigating in github, but it appears to me it is not forked from arduino/Arduino but it probably should have been, since that's where it came from. Perhaps I am looking at it incorrectly, or they wanted to have some sort of higher degree of separation than forking provides.

Does this mean there are now two IDE's?

Yes. Most definitely. At least two, not counting "third party alternatives."

Can I ask questions on these forums.?

Yes. Everything is handled here, including bare chips and 3rd party boards (although there may be better forums if you want really detailed info on a Teensy or a digiSpark.) The arduino.org forums are a bid sad and empty. Note that very little of the help you might get here comes from anyone who is compensated by either Arduino.org organization.

I wanted to do the right thing too. Ordered the wrong board it seems.

You did fine. The saddest thing about the schism is that the two halves really do seem to have complementary skill sets. Software development vs Manufacturing. Sigh.

The Genuino board appears to be a different board from the Uno. It uses an Intel chip.

"Genuino" is a brand name like "Arduino." You have to look further for the board type. "Genuino 101" is the Intel board, but "Genuino Uno" and "Arduino Uno" are identical (or almost identical.)

dmjlambert: The Intel chip you are thinking about is on the Arduino/Genuino 101. The Uno still has the ATMEL ATmega328P chip on it no matter what the manufacturer is. In fact, if you get some other Arduino such as a Nano with ATmega328P on it, if you write the Uno bootloader onto it, it will be an Uno as far as the IDE is concerned.

Correct, my mistake and thanks for the tip on the Nano.

westfw: Note that very little of the help you might get here comes from anyone who is compensated by either Arduino.org organization.

I was under the impression that the Mods are mostly volunteers. Don´t worry I realize this board is not a helpdesk. Will be doing my own homework.

SurfingDude: Hello Mrayes,

It's saddening that you got confused by the shenanigans, I think that the .org group is profiting from your confusion. There are also in circulation some counterfeit boards sold through ebay.

Don't know what I'm doing yet so won't be adding another unknown variable into the mix, plus I avoid Ebay if at all possible, but thanks for the warning.

cr0sh: Just continue to study the issue from time-to-time, keep tabs on it - but don't stress over it (because there ain't anything you can do 'bout it!). Instead, focus on your project and learning the Arduino, and becoming part of this community.

You're right thanks. Was getting myself into a bit of a flap over this and it's not even my fight. Not my circus, not my monkeys. Will be focusing on the learning, the fun and the frustration (Well on that not so much) for now. :)

I'll let the courts decide the legal issues. This is what matters to me: |500x168