Getting grumpier the longer I am here

In the beginning, I thought some of the responses by long time members was a little bit on the terse/rude side. I now find myself getting the same way. :confused:

The more I read posts from those that have no idea what they are talking about and want help without doing any research, the worse the feeling gets.

There are those that ask for solutions to problems but give no information. Those that refuse to follow rules (or even read them). Those that expect us to interpret a page of text all in lowercase and no punctuation.

I take my hat off to the administrators and moderators. Long may they reign.

I also thank those that take time to answer the frustrating questions of others. I have certainly learnt a lot from reading their posts.

Weedpharma

I would not say I get grumpier the longer I'm here but I have become more selective in what I read and reply too.

If a post with an interesting subject header has several replies I may look at but probably not reply to it.

If the subject header is not descriptive I don't bother reading it.

If I read it and the OP have obviously not done much/any research I don't bother relying.

@weedpharma you have expressed very clearly and succinctly what pushed me to start the Thread The Underused Brain.

Having considered the responses and thought more about it I think I have given up the idea of trying to write a Thread / tutorial aimed at the sort of problems you mention

While Titles like "Please Help" are, logically speaking, stupid they often sit on top of perfectly reasonable and interesting questions so I don't ignore them.

I try to remind myself that many of the questions come from beginners to programming who probably do not appreciate the importance of the info they don't supply.

What pisses me off is when questions or perfectly good suggestions are completely ignored.

...R

I concur with the sentiments in your thread.

Weedpharma

weedpharma: In the beginning, I thought some of the responses by long time members was a little bit on the terse/rude side. I now find myself getting the same way. :confused:

The more I read posts from those that have no idea what they are talking about and want help without doing any research, the worse the feeling gets.

There are those that ask for solutions to problems but give no information. Those that refuse to follow rules (or even read them). Those that expect us to interpret a page of text all in lowercase and no punctuation.

I take my hat off to the administrators and moderators. Long may they reign.

I also thank those that take time to answer the frustrating questions of others. I have certainly learnt a lot from reading their posts.

Weedpharma

Just a few minutes ago I read a post from someone who had a handful of parts but knew nothing, saying that this was the most unhelpful forum ever, that it was all look here, look there and no specifics.

And I thought, you think you have seen unhelpful. Just wait, no one likes that attitude.

There are those among us who used to frequent technical groups on usenet. Not having done your homework and asking childish questions would have been unthinkable. If you wanted help from an expert you had to earn it, and everyone played by those rules.

The problem here is that many expect to be just given the answer to their often unworkable projects.

What are they, children? And, I think, often they are. They have learned to expect and not learned how to do your own work. There is no solution for that, other than to grow up.

As far as poor grammar. I think they should post in Arabic, where there is no uppercase, no punctuation, and for that matter, no vowels. Seems like the right language for them. How's that for grumpy?

I thought I had my grumps under control.....then along came Fatfairy!!

Weedpharma

weedpharma: I thought I had my grumps under control.....then along came Fatfairy!!

I was going to point them in the right direction until they offered the 'unhelpful' comment. A simple Google search for the part number + Arduino on the end finds bucket loads of examples and wiring diagrams yet they expect to be spoon fed answers.

weedpharma:
I thought I had my grumps under control…then along came Fatfairy!!

Weedpharma

That would be the one!

Being frustrated and even mad is still no excuse for being a jerk when replying to a question.

Perhaps, but not even trying to see if your problem has been addressed (and solved) hundreds of times already, trumps that. And don't get me started about those that seem to think they can put any demands on these forums.

dfoliver: Being frustrated and even mad is still no excuse for being a jerk when replying to a question.

The words of a saint ...

You are, of course, quite correct. But when a person is frustrated or mad s/he does not always do the correct thing.

And some questions seem pretty jerky ...

Even so, I do not think it is acceptable to answer badly when you are not mad.

...R

Most posts are answered civilly in the first response. The the chagrin comes along when perfectly good advice is ignored and the responder abused.

Weedpharma

weedpharma: Most posts are answered civilly in the first response. The the chagrin comes along when perfectly good advice is ignored and the responder abused.

Actually I just ignore those threads.

Uh-oh.

Now we've done it. It popped up here too. This thread is doomed !

There is another newbie that will not use any punctuation. Why do members answer the problem when others have requested a rewrite? How are they going to learn if they get their answers without the basic courtesy of using punctuation?

I am not referring the those of non English background. They are easily picked and sometimes easier to understand!

Weedpharma

weedpharma: I am not referring the those of non English background. They are easily picked and sometimes easier to understand!

I agree. The people who apologize for their English are often much better at it than some who don't.

...R

Then you have the newbies, who have clearly read the 'how to use' messages, state things clear and concise, use code boxes, etc...

And they are still treated like dirt by people who are so far up themselves. One can understand the back lash received by newbies met with insults rather than actual help.

http://forum.arduino.cc/index.php?topic=349009.0

Seriously Paul, WTF?

pYro_65: Then you have the newbies, who have clearly read the 'how to use' messages, state things clear and concise, use code boxes, etc...

And they are still treated like dirt by people who are so far up themselves. One can understand the back lash received by newbies met with insults rather than actual help.

http://forum.arduino.cc/index.php?topic=349009.0

Seriously Paul, WTF?

Certainly out of line there.

If you answer a lot of posts, and with so many of them obstinately clueless, you can make a mistake in judging the question.

I've just read the last dozen or so of Paul's posts and he is direct and to the point and not only answers the question but gets it right.

In that thread, that was Paul's only post, he didn't return fire.

Newbies are going to have to realize they are going to catch some flack every now and then, not all of it deserved. But the benefit you get from a grumpy old man, who is on point and absolutely right, far exceeds that value of the help from the kindly but ignorant.

It ain't easy being agreeably pleasant always, so you have to cut everyone some slack some time, and cut them loose when they don't come around.

cyberjeff: It ain't easy being agreeably pleasant always, so you have to cut everyone some slack some time, and cut them loose when they don't come around.

Well.. Just don't post. Its not anyone's duty to respond. And previous insightful help is in no way a justification for petty name calling.

In that thread, that was Paul's only post, he didn't return fire.

Cos, he'd only make things worse if he did.

As a newbie I agree that there is a lot of "I want to do this, tell me how" type of posts, but there are also a lot of poorly worded posts that still are seeking specific information. Lots of us newbies don't know what we don't know and while there is a whole great big set of resources out there, finding the right one to answer your question can be hard. A lot of us are kind of isolated, too, in the sense we are working without any other folks to turn to for answers to basic questions.

Also I understand that it can be very frustrating, especially when someone won't listen, but as pYro says, you don't have to respond, and you especially don't have to respond with an insult.