How do makers use Non-Dip chips on their prototypes and final projects?

I have an Arduino Uno which has an 328P-PU in DIP.

I understand that if I need to program the 328P-PU, I can just plug it into my Arduino Uno.

What I'm curious about are the other Arduino boards and their respective microcontrollers which are not in DIP format.

Do most people just use the entire board on their projects after prototyping with them?

If they use a separately bought microcontrollers....

*Using their Arduino board, how do they program compatible microcontrollers that they bought separately?
(Arduino Mega 2560 programming a separately bought ATMega 2560)

*How feasible/easy/difficult is it to use separately bought Non-Dip microcontrollers (ie ATmega 2560, ARM chip on the Zero) on a project? How difficult is it to solder for a non-engineer self-learning hobbyist?

*Can an Arduino Mega 2560 program a different microcontroller than the one on-board?
(Arduino Mega 2560 programing an ATmega 328?)

Thank you very much. I hope question are not too confusing.

it is difficult to solder non dip microcontrollers. it takes a lot of practice.

but, I recently found out about PCB stencilling.

that and solder paste might make it easier.

Most people either use a small Atmega328 board (ie a pro mini) or other breakout board, either supplied assembled or which they themselves have soldered the part down to.

In addition to general purpose breakout boards for different packages, boards meant for use with AVR chips, including the ISP header and an FTDI header for serial are available (sometimes assembled). I sell somein my Tindie shop for the mega x8 and most ATtiny's (including the awesome 841 and 1634), and I know Crossroads sells some nice ones for the ATmega1284p, which is also an excellent chip. Having the ISP header and decoupling caps + crystal right on the board makes things a lot easier, while small boards are available that are suitable for including in projects.

If you're more serious about a custom design, you might design your own PCB (it's not that hard, hell, even I can do it) after prototyping with a generic board.

Assembling SMD components is not that hard - the harder part is getting an appropriate board imo. If you don't know about drag soldering and try to solder each pin individually (or if you don't have a board and are "dead bugging" it), it's very hard - but you don't have to do it that way.
Get some flux, and a half-decent soldering iron (I always recommend used wellers from ebay with the teal blue case - they'll outlive you; even the cheap ones with magnetic temp control are fine. The later ones that aren't teal blue don't seem to be of the same quality. There are also some passable ones by Hakko that a lot of people seem to use) and youtube "drag soldering" for some instructional videos. It's like magic - you just touch the iron with a tiny bit of solder to the flux'ed pins... and there's a puff of smoke, and you look down and the pins are soldered. The first time I did it, I instantly got better results, even with no practice.
SOIC is a cinch with drag soldering (easier and faster IMO than DIP into protoboard - no lie), and TSSOP, TQFP isn't that bad either. Anything without leads (like QFN, DFN, etc) is rough though without a reflow oven and stencils - it can be done, but it's harder.
Passives like resistors and stuff, you put a bit of solder on one pad per part, position part with tweezers and hit that side, then go back and do the other end.
It's nowhere near as bad as some people say it is, but you need good lighting, appropriate glasses (if you need them), solder sucker, non-radio-shack-grade soldering iron and tweezers. Use 60/40 leaded solder if you can, it's much easier to work with than lead-free.

An arduino mega, or an arduino uno, or pro mini, or micro/leo can be used as an ISP programmer to program and bootload chips. You can also get a USB Asp for like $3 on ebay, and these work great, and there's a lovely GUI that you can use with them too to view flash/eeprom/fuses on the chip (I have found this incredibly valuable), or use a pro mini or micro (both about same price on ebay) put ArduinoAsISP on it and dub it your ISP programmer.

Also, as it happens, I sell some generic and less generic prototyping board (buy from my tindie, or see my product page), some of which has a bunch of footprints for common SMD packages.

For PROGAMMING the chip, you would usually either use an ISP connection to the assembled board, or buy your chips pre-programmed from a vendor that offers that service.

For assembly... You pretty much change your thinking from "chip replacement" to "board replacement" if things go wrong. You can do "rework" of SMT boards, but it's certainly harder than just plugging in a new chip (NOT any harder than unsocketed DIP parts, though.)

Hi,

I guess the most people will use the Uno in their final Product.
If You want to go with more advanced design (without ISP Connector)
You can buy factory new chips and burn Your software with adapter board like I'm using it.

On the first one, I can programm 328P-AU on the second (empty) one the 16U2.

Regards,
Maverick

filet:
I have an Arduino Uno which has an 328P-PU in DIP.

I understand that if I need to program the 328P-PU, I can just plug it into my Arduino Uno.

What I'm curious about are the other Arduino boards and their respective microcontrollers which are not in DIP format.

Do most people just use the entire board on their projects after prototyping with them?

Other than breadboarding, I just design and layout my own pcb's. It's not too hard. You can use EagleCAD or KiCAD for the circuit design and pcb layout. There are multiple PCB manufacturing house that accept gerber design files. I have had good results with ITeadStudio out of China, $20 will get you 10 50mmx50mm 2 layer in about 3 weeks. ChipQwik rework Solder paste with a steady hand, some cosmetic tweezers and a Toaster Oven.

Here is a Shield I designed and built to add 1MB of RAM to a Mega2560

Here is a ATMega2560 custom board. I use ISP programming and the Arduino environment to create software and flash it.

filet:
*Using their Arduino board, how do they program compatible microcontrollers that they bought separately?
(Arduino Mega 2560 programming a separately bought ATMega 2560)

As long as you load the correct ISP programmer code into the Arduino(Mega,Uno,Nano...), It just passes the data to the ISP target.

filet:
*How feasible/easy/difficult is it to use separately bought Non-Dip microcontrollers (ie ATmega 2560, ARM chip on the Zero) on a project? How difficult is it to solder for a non-engineer self-learning hobbyist?

Just time and effort. The Hobbist license for EagleCAD is $169.00 (16cm x 10cm 6 layer PCB),
Toaster Over $90, ChipQwik rework solder(6CC syringe) $20. Oven thermometer $25 (300C range).

  • parts

Chuck.

That didn't work for me... But I think u was using the wrong thermometer...

My board started smoking but the themometer only said 225f

Also, I found it difficult to place the smd components.. a pwm ic and some ceramic caps..

I think if I had to do it again I'd get a pcb with a whole lot of the same type of chip and practice on it.