Control tree 12v Waterpumps

Hi all,
I'm a newbe to adruino, so please forgive my maybe silly question.

I want to control 3 12 V waterpumps with an arduino uno to water my plants when I'm on holiday.
Let's say the arduino should run each pump all 5 days for several seconds. The 3 pumps don't need to run all at the same time, one after the other should do the job.

I thought to get an arduino uno and 2 velleman stackable motor shields and 3 dc adapters. 1 x 5v for the ardunio and 2x 12v for the motor shields.

Does anybody know if this setup would work ?

Thanks in advance for a feedback
acki4711

acki4711:
Hi all,
I'm a newbe to adruino, so please forgive my maybe silly question.

I want to control 3 12 V waterpumps with an arduino uno to water my plants when I'm on holiday.
Let's say the arduino should run each pump all 5 days for several seconds. The 3 pumps don't need to run all at the same time, one after the other should do the job.

I thought to get an arduino uno and 2 velleman stackable motor shields and 3 dc adapters. 1 x 5v for the ardunio and 2x 12v for the motor shields.

Does anybody know if this setup would work ?

Thanks in advance for a feedback
acki4711

There should be no problems as long as:-
a. The current consumption of the pumps is within spec for the motor shields.
b. The shields allow you to select the UNO pins used for each, so that they're not both connected to the same pins. The datasheet for the shields should mention this.
c. The 12VDC supplies are rated higher than the current consumption of the pump motors. You could even use just one 12VDC adaptor connected to both shields, especially if you only intend to run one pump at a time. If more than one at a time, ensure that it can handle the current of all pumps running at the same time, with enough overhead for startup current.

As you don't need to control speed and direction of the DC pump motors a simpler and cheaper solution would be to use a relay board like this.

Riva:
As you don't need to control speed and direction of the DC pump motors a simpler and cheaper solution would be to use a relay board like this.

That's a better answer. I just directly answered the acki4711's question, without thinking about more practical ways of doing it. :frowning:
(Another XY case. :slight_smile: )

Riva,
Thanks for your reply.
I've seen boards like this as well, Was just not sure if they allow to connect external power ?

I used these kind of relays to control the AC devices, so yes they allow to connect external power.

acki4711:
Riva,
Thanks for your reply.
I've seen boards like this as well, Was just not sure if they allow to connect external power ?

relay boards with 12 volt relays allow for three power sources.

#1) control switching. this is to turn on an off the on-board optioisolator. needs 20mA, voltage is un-important, but many have a resistor on-board selected for 5v control. you have to add more to use 12 volts for the logic control

#2) relay power. this is a separte input and must be the voltage of the relay. you can read the relay voltage on the relay and it is in the part number, the relays RIVA linked were SONGLE - SRD-05VDC-SL-C guess you can tell that partibular board requires a separate 5 volt DC power supply that has to be selected for the power of the number of relays on the board. you can find the data sheet to get that.

#3) the relay contacts. the relay contacts are also listed on the relay. the power that the linked relays can handel are 10 amps at 230VAC or 10 amsp at 120 VAC or 10 amps a 28VDC or 10 amps at 30VDC.

the power that the relay can switch is based on the load.
the data sheet should separate how much it can handle, amps at a voltage, for each type of load.
usually one listing is motor size, for an inductive load.
a separate amps at voltage for an AC resistive load
and yet a separate amps at voltage for a DC load.

that's it for the relay. I cannot attest if that linked board can handle 10 amps at 120 volts on the TRACES of the circuit board.

finally, you can get the exact same relay boards with 12VDC relays.
choose wisely.

Thanks all for your help guys.

I ordered this board now:

What I still don't understand is are the waterpumps taking the power from the external 12v power Ithat I attach to the board or do they need to be powered seperatly ?

Does sombody has a picture/video how to wire it like I mentioned ?

Thanks in advance
acki4711

there are THREE(3) possible voltages.

#1)
the Arduino requires a voltage.

#2)
the COIL, and only the coil of the relay, just the coil itself, requires a very specific voltage and that is printed on the case of the relay or in the model number or on the manufactures data sheet.

#3)
the CONTACTS... well, these are just wires, so you pick whatever you want as long as the wires can handle the power.


we have to add things to make it do what we want. in some cases, we add a diode, sometimes it is already installed, some times, we do not care because the relay board is isolated from the Arduino.

sometimes the relay is put on a board for us and sold as a unit. the manufacturer might add things like opto-isolators, or transistors or other things, and then tell us that they only need 5v and 10mA. this is common with the board you have.

this is the part you seem to be having a hard time grasping.

all the ARDUINO does is to change the state of the opto-isolator. an opto-isolator is like an LED inside of a box. you light that LED and inside that tiny box, there is a receiver that sees that LED and then it does whatever it does.
the connection between your device and the other side is light. only light. since it is light, we call that optical, or opto for short. and because there is no electrical connection we call that isolation so we call this an opto-isolator.

someone else picked all the electronical bits on the other side of that opto-isolator, so you do not have to.

but, you have to apply power that the COIL requires. when they made that circuit, they picked everything needed to work with that voltage.

I'd just like to add that the relay COIL supply can usually come from the 5V pin on the Arduino. You don't need a third power supply.

I say "usually" because it is possible to overload the Arduino's 5V regulator with too much current out or too much voltage in. But for 4 relays, it should be fine.

MorganS:
I'd just like to add that the relay COIL supply can usually come from the 5V pin on the Arduino. You don't need a third power supply.

I say "usually" because it is possible to overload the Arduino's 5V regulator with too much current out or too much voltage in. But for 4 relays, it should be fine.

what he bought :
12V 4-Kanal Relais Modul High Level Triger+400 P Steckboard+120x Jump Kabel M

the 12v would be the green part in my drawing.

#2)
the COIL, and only the coil of the relay, just the coil itself, requires a very specific voltage and that is printed on the case of the relay or in the model number or on the manufactures data sheet

MorganS:
I'd just like to add that the relay COIL supply can usually come from the 5V pin on the Arduino. You don't need a third power supply.

I say "usually" because it is possible to overload the Arduino's 5V regulator with too much current out or too much voltage in. But for 4 relays, it should be fine.

the Songel 5v relay specs out at about 72 mA. 4 of them is just under 300mA
the power for the (5) on-board LED's, probably another 10mA each, and you need to power the opto with another 10mA, figure about 80mA for just the optos and LEDs.
an Arduino UNO in idle, with nothing running uses about 45mA

if you are feeding from a USB, you have a generic 500mA limit, so have to do everything else with 75mA

OK guys, thank you very much for your patience and help.
As I got it know I need 3 independend power sources.

  1. to power the arduino (5V)
  2. to power the relay bord (12 V DC)
  3. to power the waterpumps (12 or whatever voltage)

Just to make things clear about the wireing, is my thinking correct:

  1. I remove the JD-VCC/VCC Jumper
  2. connect the + from externeal 12V to VCC (where the jumper was)
  3. connect 5V port from arduinoto to VCC Input on relay board (where the input pins are)
  4. connect output pin (example 13) from arduino to any of the input pins (In0)

Question what do I do with the neg. port of external power supply ? Do I put it into GRN on arduino board ?

Thanks again
acki4711

... or to the GRN on the relay board where the input pins are ?

all DC grounds should be in common.

acki4711:
2) connect the + from externeal 12V to VCC (where the jumper was)

Before you do this I think you should get some more consensus as I think you need to connect the 12V to the JD-VCC pin and not the VCC pin as this may be linked to the VCC pin of the Arduino connector and you would put 12V on a 5V system an cause damage.

Based on this image

Thanks folks for all your effort,
Without any offence, but unfortunately posting schematics don't help me much as I can understand them.

So it looks like I fried my board by putting the + to VCC instead of JD-VCC. :o :frowning:
(Not possible to upload any other sketch or get board info anymore)

Just to make things clear I draw a picture. Would this be correct now. (Don't wana fry another uno... :confused:

Without any offence, but unfortunately posting pictures don't help me much as I cannot see how the traces are connected.

find the manufacturer of THAT EXACT board, not a clone,
get the schematic and post that.

I believe that SainSmart puts in a selector switch to allow you to use either your Vcc to power the relay. You can select your 5 volts to burn out when you try to run 12v relays, or you can use the switch to connect the proper 12 volts that you put on the JD-Vcc connection.

I cannot see well, but your board may only accept one or the other, not both.

also, you do not show the ground connected to the JD-Vcc connection
and you do not show any ground on the logic side of the relay board.

post a link to where you bought your relay board.

Dave,
Here is the link where I got the board.

http://www.ebay.de/itm/12V-4-Kanal-Relais-Modul-High-Level-Triger-400-P-Steckboard-120x-Jump-Kabel-M-/231971686540?hash=item360297088c:g:68MAAOSwQupXVuQR

TIA
acki4711

does your board say SainSmart ?
it looks identical

connect you 12V power to JD-Vcc, remove the jumper if there is one.

connect your 5V from your power supply to the Vcc pin next to the inputs
connect your pins to the 4 inputs. these are pull down to activate a relay.
connect both the Arduino ground and the power supply ground together.

that should do it.