2nd Arduino, Different Problem, Still Useless.

Development Tools IDE 1.x
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OK so in my last thread the apparently "fakeduino" UNO Rev1 (impossible to visually see a difference, just no "Made in Italy" writing on it) failed the loopback test. Since I have no real idea what to do next I went and got a certified real "Arduino" UNO Rev3 (papers and everything) because I have a project that requires me to learn and implement the "C" language and I need a development environment to work with.

So my problem this time is, (oh, and I know it will get blamed on windows for sure this time) when I plug the Arduino UNO into the computer it is seen as "other devices" in the hardware manager. I am using xp professional SP3 if it matters. Under the "Other Devices" dropdown it shows as ATMega16U2. When I tell it to update driver and browse to the driver folder in either Arduino 1.0 or 0023 (tried both) it says it cannot find the necessary software. If I try and select a specific piece of hardware from the list the ATmega16u2 is not in the list under any of the possible selections ( I looked at every single line item and all of their children). I have tried this on 2 different XP Prof. computers so far. I may try it on a Vista machine later tonight. (I really hate Vista BTW) Also my fakeduino that failed the Loop Back test is shown as an Arduino UNO when I connect it to the computer. It just doesn't want to play.

More info. The new Arduino passed the Loop Back test with and without ???? :-? jumpers installed. Both in serial monitor and hyperterminal.

I know in my searching for the solutions to these issues (days of a little here a little there, probably 12 hours total so far) I have yet to see the answer to the question " How would you define either a successful or failed loopback test" On this new Arduino once I plug it in to the computer both the "On" and "L" lights stay on consistently. On the old arduino the RX light would flash at every send command in serial monitor.

My guess is that there is no bootloader installed or the ATmega16u2 firmware needs to be updated. Seriously just a guess. Anyone have any ideas? Getting ready to abondon the Arduino and just get the super expensive development kit from Renesas for the chip I want to use. (i really don't want to do that but don't have time to waste on this). I have heard it mentioned that "Flash programming the processor should be a given, not a chore." So how do we fix this one, most basic issue? I am just now embarking upon the "C" adventure so some advice/guidance would be great.

I will end this by saying that although I have been programming PLC's (logic mostly)for a while now, I am not by any means "knowledgeable" in this (microprocessor) arena.

Sorry for the long and frustrated post. Thanks for any new ideas. And yes I have tried to install every .inf file in both the 1.0 and 0023 drivers folders. In each instance it was not recognized as a legitimate file for the ATmega16u2. Perhaps in one of Arduinos' 3 tests to, and I quote, " make sure they are not faulty" they didn't watch the results info before throwing it into a box. ??

And yes the Dr. McGillicuddy's has removed my better sense so please understand that some issues may be a little out of sorts. End of Rant. :slight_smile:

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Shouldn't be like work at all, should it? [No way**!**] If it tanks, it wanks.
I bought some "Roboduino" DMNs that shipped with shorty USB cables (a package deal).
I tried two of three, they cratered and I got concerned. So, I swapped out to one of the other cables and still a cipher.
Then I got out the cable that I got with another bunch altogether and all was good.
I pulled out cable #3 and it sucked, too.
So, the stinking cables were NFG, but the boards were good.

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If the uno is not seen as a comport, then he Arduino UNO.inf file in the driver folder should be selected for installation. Others have seen the boards appear under the USB devices and apparently updated the driver there.

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Thanks Mr. Pancake. I get the gist of what you are saying. I do know however that my cable is just fine. I've been using it to program the new Control Logix L72 processor without issue. Unfortunately the search function on this board does now allow the use of the back button ("webpage expired" message, get to start all over each time, Lovin it) so finding answers is slow at best.

So as not to be a total a**. I can and do appreciate those of you who have had success with these and are willing to share ideas/opinions with the rest of us who are still trying to find some nugget of success in this venture. Thanks to ya'll. (love that word)

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So my problem this time is, (oh, and I know it will get blamed on windows for sure this time) when I plug the Arduino UNO into the computer it is seen as "other devices" in the hardware manager. I am using xp professional SP3 if it matters. Under the "Other Devices" dropdown it shows as ATMega16U2. When I tell it to update driver and browse to the driver folder in either Arduino 1.0 or 0023 (tried both) it says it cannot find the necessary software. If I try and select a specific piece of hardware from the list the ATmega16u2 is not in the list under any of the possible selections ( I looked at every single line item and all of their children).

So you are not able to find the Arduino UNO.inf file in the arduino driver folder?

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Well yes I can see it if I go to C:\program files\ etc.etc. When I am trying to update the driver for my "other device" and select the drivers folder (cannot see inside other than the FTDI subfolder, which I am not clicking on BTW) it responds with the answer that there is no software for my hardware in the folder.

The more I chase this issue it does seem windows related.(somewhere I hear someone saying"I told you so") I was able to get the vista machine to acknowledge the Arduino board and make it a com port but the driver installation failed repeatedly so now I have the board listed as com7 but with the yellow triangle of failure. I cannot access Com7 from the Arduino Tools dropdown. I tried renaming it to com 5 which I can see from the dropdown but since it was a piggybacked port it didn't work.

Perhaps I should just try and find the drivers and re download them. Seems I am chasing my tail.

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Dirtleg:
I have a project that requires me to learn and implement the "C" language and I need a development environment to work with.

You certainly don't need an embedded processor to learn C. In fact, if your ONLY goal is to learn C, you are better off with a PC-based development environment. You'll get far better debugging tools.

Dirtleg:
When I tell it to update driver and browse to the driver folder in either Arduino 1.0 or 0023 (tried both) it says it cannot find the necessary software.

A common mistake is to click on the FTDI folder. The correct folder is just called "drivers". (though you mention trying all the infs, so this may not apply.)

Dirtleg:
The new Arduino passed the Loop Back test with and without ???? :-? jumpers installed. Both in serial monitor and hyperterminal.

This behavior doesn't make sense. If the TX and RX lines aren't connected together, then there is nothing to echo back. If the drivers aren't installed correctly, then the loop back test doesn't do you any good anyway...

Dirtleg:
I have yet to see the answer to the question " How would you define either a successful or failed loopback test"

In this loop back instructions it clearly says: "8. Send data by typing. Everything you type should be echoed back. To send data, some terminal applications, like Serial Monitor, require pressing the Enter key or clicking a Send button. If exactly what you send is echoed back then the board passes the test. This means that the host computer hardware driver, USB cable, and USB to serial converter are all working."

How should that be worded to more clearly define passing?

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What part of the world are you in?

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Well yes I can see it if I go to C:\program files\ etc.etc. When I am trying to update the driver for my "other device" and select the drivers folder (cannot see inside other than the FTDI subfolder, which I am not clicking on BTW) it responds with the answer that there is no software for my hardware in the folder.

You are not following the windows driver install path far enough. when you get to the hardware update wizard, select the bottom no and click next. In the next window, select install from a specific location and click next. In the next window select the bottom don't search and click next.In the next window hopefully you will see device/chip listed, click have disk. In the next window, click browse. Next you should get a locate file window that is by default looking for *.inf files. Don't change the file type. now browse to the arduino drivers folder, and you should see the Arduino UNO.inf file. This is what you should select to install.

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James in response to your questions about my questions.

I am located in Appomattox Virginia.

I need to control some stepper motors, lcd and alarms based on external digital and analog inputs. Since I am a trial and error kind of guy I like to see my results more directly than say with an emulator. Yes they work but not my preferred method of testing. I have used emulators for both PLC and touchscreen programs successfullly I just prefer, whenever possible, to keep it more hands on. Also when I finish my development I will use the Arduino for automating a few of my farm chores.

I have thought about using a PC based "C" development porgram but have not put much research into which ones are worthwhile. I am leaning more that way at the moment however. Tired of chasing ghosts.

Yes I knew about not selecting the FTDI folder. But a reminder is seldom a bad thing.

Well on the loopback test with the new Arduino the TX and RX lights never blinked. I did however get every last digit echoed back. Still confused a little on this one. Thinking the ATmega16 has either none or the wrong firmware in it. Thinking about using flip to update the firmware with the UNO R3 hex file but the ATmega16u2 is not listed in target devices. The AT8u2 is listed as well as the ATmega16u4. Not sure which one to select at the moment. Still researching that one.

"In this loop back instructions it clearly says: "8. Send data by typing. Everything you type should be echoed back. To send data, some terminal applications, like Serial Monitor, require pressing the Enter key or clicking a Send button. If exactly what you send is echoed back then the board passes the test. This means that the host computer hardware driver, USB cable, and USB to serial converter are all working."

How should that be worded to more clearly define passing?

Truthfully my confusion lies in why I am getting all the data echoed back but the TX and RX lights do not blink. Is this a pass or fail?

Thank you for your input. Where do you think I should look next for some ideas? I am at a loss as to why it will not allow me to install the drivers. I have had the same problem on 3 different computers. 2 XP Prof and 1 Vista. And yes I have followed the instructions to the letter prior to attempting to figure out why they are not working like they are supposed to.

It may be of some interst that the .inf driver files are listed with a notepad icon. Strange to say the least unless that is the format they were created in. Just trying not to overlook anything.

Zoomkat wrote: You are not following the windows driver install path far enough. when you get to the hardware update wizard, select the bottom no and click next. In the next window, select install from a specific location and click next. In the next window select the bottom don't search and click next.In the next window hopefully you will see device/chip listed, click have disk. In the next window, click browse. Next you should get a locate file window that is by default looking for *.inf files. Don't change the file type. now browse to the arduino drivers folder, and you should see the Arduino UNO.inf file. This is what you should select to install.

I am sure at this point ya'll probably think I am a total moron. But let me tell you I have followed this exact procedure. Several times in fact before I started asking questions on here.
Where you say "hopefully you will see a chip listed", well I don't on the XP machines but I did on the Vista. But the driver install failed on the Vista machine. Several times in fact. I was able however to at least get it to recognize the Arduino as a com port. It's not happy with the driver file for whatever reason. Perhaps the ATmega 16 firmware is incorrect. With Rockwell software we see the Yellow triangle of failure when there are incorrect or corrupt firmware revisions on the installed devices. Also incorrect class instances will upset the balance.

I also moved the UNOR3 driver to my desktop and tried to update it from there. Noworky either.So is there someplace on this website that hosts just the drivers by themselves?

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Oh one other thing while installing the driver in Vista. I get the message "Windows found the driver software for your device but encountered an error while attempting to install it" Followed by "This device cannot start. (Code 10)"

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I am using xp professional SP3 if it matters. Under the "Other Devices" dropdown it shows as ATMega16U2. When I tell it to update driver and browse to the driver folder in either Arduino 1.0 or 0023 (tried both) it says it cannot find the necessary software.

The driver for the Rev3 Uno is only in the 1.0 release (and not in the FTDI folder either).

If you bought a genuine Uno you should not need to update the ATmega16u2 nor the bootloader.

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If it helps, I have quite a number of Arduinos. I use them on Macs and on Windows XP and Windows 7. I don't think I have tried Vista. The platform works, and is reliable. The Rev3 Uno caused me some initial grief because the driver wasn't supplied with the 0022 release (for Windows).

Possibly your "fakeduino" installed some sort of driver that is causing problems. Try using it (the genuine Uno) on a different PC/Mac.

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I agree about the fact that since I went out and found a real Arduino I should now be enjoying the thing instead of fighting with drivers and such. Hell I cant even get it to show up in the list of available devices on either XP machine. And on the Vista the driver fails when updated. Result no com port in the Arduino software.

I suppose it's possible I got 2 bad Arduinos in a row but what are the chances of that.

The fakeduino has am At8u2 chip instead of the 16. When I plug the real one in it doesn't even come up as a com port in device manager. It is listed in "other devices". I suppose I'll uninstall the software, reinstall, reboot and then respond back here.

Again thanks for all the help.

And my ongoing question. If during the loopback test I get all my info echoed back correctly but neither the RX or TX lights flash did I pass or fail?

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Alright uninstalled the drivers for arduino, reconnected the UNO showed up in Other Devices in device manager. Went to update driver. In hardware types chose Ports (com and lpt). Said unable to find any drivers for this device. Click "Have Disk", browse to driver file "Uno Rev3". Click OK. Message "The specified location does not contain information about your hardware."

So what next? I think I need to get the driver files in the event mine are corrupt.

I still think the firmware on the mega16u2 could be bad. I tried using flip but it keeps giving me a usbLib.dll error says it cannot find the library folder. I looked in the program files and it was there. ?? Apparently this one is just not meant to be right now. Oh well. I uninstalled and reinstalled flip and that didn't help either. Same error when trying to set up communications.

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Hmm, in the Device Manager can you find out what Vendor ID and Product ID is showing up for your board? I think it's in "Advanced" > "Driver Properties" or something like that, under Hardware IDs, maybe.

It's possible that there's a problem with the 16U2 firmware, but if the board shows up at all and is listed as "Arduino Uno" (or similar) in the device manager, than the firmware is basically working (because that's where Windows gets that information).

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Well I think I am on the right track now. Since Windows was not recognizing the UNO Rev3.inf file as a legitimate resource I opened Atmel FLIP. At first I was getting a couldn't find library error when trying to set the USB communications. I went ahead and updated the driver on the Arduino to the C:\Atmel\Flip 3.4.5\usb folder and it all went in just fine. So now the UNO is listed in the device manager as Atmel USB Devices/AT mega16U2.

My next move will be to load the UNO Rev3 hex firmware file to the ATmega16U2 chip and see if I can get further into the board. If the hex file wont go in it means there is no bootloader on the mega16U2 chip and I'll have to start from there. Isn't learning fun.

So apparently the UNO left the factory without the preprogrammed firmware/and or bootloader on it. Or perhaps it was erased somewhere along the way. Who knows at this point.

And Mellis to answer your question the board never showed up as 'Arduino UNO" only "AT mega16U2". Atleast now it has a name and driver. Before it always said there was no driver available for said device.

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Be advised that recently somebody had problems with loading drivers for a board and it was determined that the maker had used a prolific USB serial chip on the board

http://arduino.cc/forum/index.php/topic,84218.0.html

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Thanks Zoomkat. I had come across that already. In this particular situation I am using a real Arduino UNO R3.

Some small progress. I was able to, using the Atmel FLIP program, load the ATmega16U2 hex file to the Arduino. It immediately notofied me of new hardware and I was able to install the UNO Rev3 driver for the board. It now appears as Arduino UNO under the com ports dropdown in device manager. I still cannot upload to the device but progress is always good. I suppose the next step will be to flash the 328 chip from the FLIP program with the correct Hex file for it and then, perhaps I can move forward with this thing.

I'll keep ya'll posted as to what I find out.

Oh and for the record, It is not a problem with Windows after all. Who would've imagined that?

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Well it appears I cannot burn the bootloader to the Mega328 without either a working Arduino, or a stand alone programmer. If I am mistaken please someone show me the way as it has not presented itself yet.

I did however steal the 328 out of the old, loop-back test failed Arduino, and put it in place of the 328 with no bootloader.
First thing I noticed is the "L" light blinks 4 times very rapidly then repeats itself after about a 1 second delay.
If I try to upload to it the blinking turns into a second on, second off blinking pattern. I get the "not in sync resp=0x00" error.

If I am understanding correctly the 1 second on/off pulsing indicates the bootloader is installed.

So where should I go next?